aria
Former Moderator
- Joined
- Dec 4, 1977
- Posts
- 39,546
[It's been a while since I've posted something with complex political, ethical and moral questions. Heaven forbid if you think I've gone soft.]
Table of Contents:
- Quick primer on the topic
- questions to consider
- news article from today's AP wire
---------------
QUICK PRIMER
---------------
If you've been following the never-ending story that is Israeli-Palestinian relations, you'll note that Israel is (and has over its history) struck at heads of Palestinian terrorist organizations (i.e. Hamas) by essentially having their air force jets fly in and blow up the place where they're at.
If you haven't wondered yet: Yes, these building tend to be apartment buildings with other, non-terrorists residing in or nearby. And yes: missles don't exactly discriminate in their massive payloads.
There's been controversy all over this tactic, and now there's been a rather unprecedented move of pilots actually refusing, en masse, to go on these missions. Needless to say, its causing some shockwaves.
------------
QUESTIONS TO CONSIDER
------------
- Do you agree with the pilots?
- Would the US/EU ever do this?
- Is this the best solution?
- Should the polits be blamed, regardless?
---------------
ARTICLE
---------------
Israel Grounds Pilots Who Refused Mission
By KARIN LAUB, Associated Press Writer
JERUSALEM - Israel on Thursday temporarily grounded reserve air force pilots who — in an unprecedented protest — condemned airstrikes in the West Bank and Gaza Strip as "immoral" and refused to fly such sorties.
The declaration by 27 pilots, including nine on active duty, was widely criticized in Israel as subversive at a time of war, but it also revived a flagging debate on the ethics of Israel's three-year war on Palestinian militants.
The protest struck a nerve because many Israelis believe their military has higher moral standards than that of their neighbors, and that other countries would have been much more ruthless.
The military is also seen as an institution that binds the fractious nation; Israelis get jittery at signs of cracks in the ranks. The air force in particular is considered key to Israel's survival, and pilots are held in the highest regard. Critics also say such talk gives ammunition to Israel's enemies.
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the rebel pilots would be dealt with swiftly.
"Everyone can express his opinion, but it is unacceptable that a group of people in the military would interfere in a subject that does not apply to them," he told Israel TV.
The air force quickly tried to contain the damage. Commander Maj. Gen. Dan Halutz said the nine active pilots, grounded for now, could face suspension and perhaps military jail if they don't retract.
He said the rebels are a tiny minority among thousands of pilots. Hundreds of pilots began circulating declarations Thursday that expressed support for their commanders.
The protesters came under fire for mixing their moral dilemma with political opinion — their declaration said the continued occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip corrupts society.
Even moderate Israelis said this is a mistake, because it could set a precedent. "When the time comes, say, to remove settlers from their homes, other people in the army or in the air force will say they don't want to obey these orders in the same way," said Col. Uri Dromi, an air force reservist.
Veteran journalist Dan Margalit wrote in a front-page commentary in the Maariv daily that the pilots abused their exalted standing.
"If their idea is accepted, Ahmed Yassin and his compatriots in the Hamas leadership will be able to plan the next murder of Jewish children on a Jerusalem bus without interference," Margalit wrote, referring to an August bus bombing that killed 23 people, six of them children.
Only veteran leaders of Israel's dovish left, including Yossi Sarid and Shulamit Aloni of the Meretz party, defended the pilots.
Several hundred Israelis have refused to serve in the West Bank and Gaza. There have been protests such as last weekend's Tel Aviv rally in which several thousand called for ending the occupation. But no major anti-war movement has emerged during the current fighting with the Palestinians, and most Israelis support the military's actions.
The group of 27 is informally led by Brig. Gen. Yiftah Spector, a highly decorated retired pilot who, according to Israeli media, took part in the bombing of an Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981.
In their petition, the pilots said airstrikes on crowded Palestinian areas are "illegal and immoral."
In three years of fighting, Israeli pilots have carried out hundreds of airstrikes, targeting Palestinian police installations and weapons workshops of militants. The most controversial involve targeted killings in which helicopters — and sometimes warplanes — fire rockets and bombs at cars and homes of Palestinian militants.
Some 140 wanted Palestinians have died in targeted raids, according to Palestinian medical officials, though the figure also includes those killed resisting arrest. More than 100 bystanders have also died, they said.
The Israeli public, traumatized by a Palestinian suicide bombing campaign that has killed hundreds since September 2000, largely supports the targeted killings.
A watershed for some pilots was last year's attack on Salah Shehadeh, leader of the Hamas military wing. A one-ton bomb killed Shehadeh, an assistant and 14 civilians, nine of them children. Halutz, the air force commander, had said he felt the bombing was morally correct.
In response to last month's Jerusalem bombing, Israel accelerated targeted attacks, killing 13 Hamas members and six bystanders in nearly a dozen airstrikes in Gaza City.
One of the 27 pilots, identified only as Capt. Alon, told the Yediot Ahronot daily he was now ashamed to be a member of the air force. "It's an organization that has no qualms about dropping bombs ... on the densest neighborhoods in the world ...," he was quoted as saying.
Brig. Gen. Eliezer Shakedi, a senior air force official, said great efforts are made to keep Palestinian civilians from harm, and that some missions were aborted if the risk to innocents was too high.
It was the first time pilots have come out openly against air force policy. In the 1982 invasion of Lebanon, some expressed reservations about bombing cities and refugee camps but did not go public.
Table of Contents:
- Quick primer on the topic
- questions to consider
- news article from today's AP wire
---------------
QUICK PRIMER
---------------
If you've been following the never-ending story that is Israeli-Palestinian relations, you'll note that Israel is (and has over its history) struck at heads of Palestinian terrorist organizations (i.e. Hamas) by essentially having their air force jets fly in and blow up the place where they're at.
If you haven't wondered yet: Yes, these building tend to be apartment buildings with other, non-terrorists residing in or nearby. And yes: missles don't exactly discriminate in their massive payloads.
There's been controversy all over this tactic, and now there's been a rather unprecedented move of pilots actually refusing, en masse, to go on these missions. Needless to say, its causing some shockwaves.
------------
QUESTIONS TO CONSIDER
------------
- Do you agree with the pilots?
- Would the US/EU ever do this?
- Is this the best solution?
- Should the polits be blamed, regardless?
---------------
ARTICLE
---------------
Israel Grounds Pilots Who Refused Mission
By KARIN LAUB, Associated Press Writer
JERUSALEM - Israel on Thursday temporarily grounded reserve air force pilots who — in an unprecedented protest — condemned airstrikes in the West Bank and Gaza Strip as "immoral" and refused to fly such sorties.
The declaration by 27 pilots, including nine on active duty, was widely criticized in Israel as subversive at a time of war, but it also revived a flagging debate on the ethics of Israel's three-year war on Palestinian militants.
The protest struck a nerve because many Israelis believe their military has higher moral standards than that of their neighbors, and that other countries would have been much more ruthless.
The military is also seen as an institution that binds the fractious nation; Israelis get jittery at signs of cracks in the ranks. The air force in particular is considered key to Israel's survival, and pilots are held in the highest regard. Critics also say such talk gives ammunition to Israel's enemies.
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the rebel pilots would be dealt with swiftly.
"Everyone can express his opinion, but it is unacceptable that a group of people in the military would interfere in a subject that does not apply to them," he told Israel TV.
The air force quickly tried to contain the damage. Commander Maj. Gen. Dan Halutz said the nine active pilots, grounded for now, could face suspension and perhaps military jail if they don't retract.
He said the rebels are a tiny minority among thousands of pilots. Hundreds of pilots began circulating declarations Thursday that expressed support for their commanders.
The protesters came under fire for mixing their moral dilemma with political opinion — their declaration said the continued occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip corrupts society.
Even moderate Israelis said this is a mistake, because it could set a precedent. "When the time comes, say, to remove settlers from their homes, other people in the army or in the air force will say they don't want to obey these orders in the same way," said Col. Uri Dromi, an air force reservist.
Veteran journalist Dan Margalit wrote in a front-page commentary in the Maariv daily that the pilots abused their exalted standing.
"If their idea is accepted, Ahmed Yassin and his compatriots in the Hamas leadership will be able to plan the next murder of Jewish children on a Jerusalem bus without interference," Margalit wrote, referring to an August bus bombing that killed 23 people, six of them children.
Only veteran leaders of Israel's dovish left, including Yossi Sarid and Shulamit Aloni of the Meretz party, defended the pilots.
Several hundred Israelis have refused to serve in the West Bank and Gaza. There have been protests such as last weekend's Tel Aviv rally in which several thousand called for ending the occupation. But no major anti-war movement has emerged during the current fighting with the Palestinians, and most Israelis support the military's actions.
The group of 27 is informally led by Brig. Gen. Yiftah Spector, a highly decorated retired pilot who, according to Israeli media, took part in the bombing of an Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981.
In their petition, the pilots said airstrikes on crowded Palestinian areas are "illegal and immoral."
In three years of fighting, Israeli pilots have carried out hundreds of airstrikes, targeting Palestinian police installations and weapons workshops of militants. The most controversial involve targeted killings in which helicopters — and sometimes warplanes — fire rockets and bombs at cars and homes of Palestinian militants.
Some 140 wanted Palestinians have died in targeted raids, according to Palestinian medical officials, though the figure also includes those killed resisting arrest. More than 100 bystanders have also died, they said.
The Israeli public, traumatized by a Palestinian suicide bombing campaign that has killed hundreds since September 2000, largely supports the targeted killings.
A watershed for some pilots was last year's attack on Salah Shehadeh, leader of the Hamas military wing. A one-ton bomb killed Shehadeh, an assistant and 14 civilians, nine of them children. Halutz, the air force commander, had said he felt the bombing was morally correct.
In response to last month's Jerusalem bombing, Israel accelerated targeted attacks, killing 13 Hamas members and six bystanders in nearly a dozen airstrikes in Gaza City.
One of the 27 pilots, identified only as Capt. Alon, told the Yediot Ahronot daily he was now ashamed to be a member of the air force. "It's an organization that has no qualms about dropping bombs ... on the densest neighborhoods in the world ...," he was quoted as saying.
Brig. Gen. Eliezer Shakedi, a senior air force official, said great efforts are made to keep Palestinian civilians from harm, and that some missions were aborted if the risk to innocents was too high.
It was the first time pilots have come out openly against air force policy. In the 1982 invasion of Lebanon, some expressed reservations about bombing cities and refugee camps but did not go public.
.
