Earlier AES = better quality

Shito · Jun 29, 2003

Yep, it's true.

I've just run a comparison with all my AES systems (4 in total) and it's pretty EVIDENT older system (the ones with the first revion of the board, aka those needing the AC PRO-POW of PRO-POW2) have better picture quality and sound.

The latter systems (those using the PRO-POW3 adaptor) have lower colour dept, lower video output (with graphic generated like in 'square boxes' of pixel) and poorest sound.

All the systems were tested with Matrimelee and pure RGB output.

Well, I would say the first revision of the board is almost identical to MVS, while the latter was maybe toned down to reduce chipset production costs as well as power needs (PRO-POW3 is way different from PRO-POW and PRO-POW2).

Discuss.

[ June 29, 2003, 06:10 PM: Message edited by: Shito ]

LWK · Jun 29, 2003

My HC system is 012168

Is that shite or no?

HPMAN · Jun 29, 2003

As of myself I found very early systems to have badder picture quality (darker, so scanlines are more visible). Don't have to complain about later systems. Of course it depends on what you call later systems, my "later systems" are in the 50000 range serial, so they're still old by themselves.

I'm talking about RGB signal, everything else if of course totally gay

Shito · Jun 29, 2003

HPMAN:
As of myself I found very early systems to have badder picture quality (darker, so scanlines are more visible). Don't have to complain about later systems. Of course it depends on what you call later systems, my "later systems" are in the 50000 range serial, so they're still old by themselves.

I'm talking about RGB signal, everything else if of course totally gay

As for me, it's just the contrary.

Latest system, especially when connetcted to largest TV, shows a kind of 'reticolation', like all the graphic is composed by squared block of pixels.

SSS · Jun 29, 2003

Here is a very good thread regarding video quality of early Neo systems.

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004315" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004315</a>

I can't attest for the quality of the RGB out on the early systems (as I live in the states :mad:

) but the composite out on my system with the daughterboard fix is probably the cleanest I've seen on any homecart system. It's better than my Japanese cart system (serial in the 2##,###) and my svideo modded early cart system without the daughterboard fix (composite out on that one is a mess, colors bleed all over the place)

Wan-Fu · Jun 29, 2003

I can say from experience that systems with serial number over 200K produce the grid pattern. The systems below 60K S/N have a sharp image but darker than the MVS RGB. The best video output I have seen actually came from a 120K S/N. It was not perfect but it was the best RGB from a stock system.

By the way, I was using an XRGB-2+.

[ June 29, 2003, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: Wan-Fu ]

Big Bruno · Jun 29, 2003

Maybe the older systems with the Video output fixed. Remember though with the Early NGH systems they had recalled them and had the video output repaired with that daughtercard fix. Although if you ask me it puts more wires for the signals to go through. I think it also depends on the TV you use/Cabeling/ etc.

ThePunisher · Jun 29, 2003

HPMAN:
I'm talking about RGB signal, everything else if of course totally gay

Thats funny I didnt know it was possible for video output to have a sexual preference.

Winston Goh · Jun 29, 2003

Ealier System - Better AC Adaptor, Stronger RGB
In Betweeb Early And Midrange - Start Of Pixelated Pic, Weak RGB output, no good for S-Video. Start Of using cheaper PSU. Use of cheaper Components.
Mid Range - Good RGB, Good Composite. Use of better component.
Latest System - Sharp and Bright S-Video, Very Pixelated. Vertical Line is RGB.

Note - For every revision, there can be sub revision where the diff is in the supply section.

On some system, by varying voltage supply to the CXA chip, you can get smoother pic that is less pixelated.

For In-between model, to get better S-Video, vary the 75Ohm resistor. Abt 120Ohm and you get S-video that don flicker that much

Shito · Jun 30, 2003

Winston Goh:
Ealier System - Better AC Adaptor, Stronger RGB
In Betweeb Early And Midrange - Start Of Pixelated Pic, Weak RGB output, no good for S-Video. Start Of using cheaper PSU. Use of cheaper Components.
Mid Range - Good RGB, Good Composite. Use of better component.
Latest System - Sharp and Bright S-Video, Very Pixelated. Vertical Line is RGB.

Note - For every revision, there can be sub revision where the diff is in the supply section.

This is very interesting.

I've got a very early NEO-AEC (thus US version). The serial number is 00020XX. THe picture quality is GREAT, yet as it's US, I can't hear the sound in Matrimelee: songs are not coming out, and even voices from fighter are gone: is that normal? (I knew about the music, but not about the voice effects)

Winston Goh · Jun 30, 2003

I can't afford Matrimalee right now but if it play fine on other game, it properly ok but if it does not, I check the section around the 6110 and z80.

For the early 5V system, beside Neo AEC , there is a Neo Nec or Neo AES. Can't remember but the one I seen was modded to shit by the shop who sold it to my friend.

[ June 30, 2003, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: Winston Goh ]

Jashin · Jun 30, 2003

From my limited experience, I'd agree with what has been said here. My first system was a late JPN model, and had an awful RGB picture - the 'pixellated' look that people have described. As this drove me up the wall, I bought an early US model from Tarma, and the difference in picture quality was amazing. The pixellated look was gone, and the colours seemed more vibrant (albeit darker). All in all, a far stronger picture.

[ June 30, 2003, 06:09 AM: Message edited by: Jashin ]

rudekid · Jun 30, 2003

i have a pro pow 3 serial 115549 is there a big diffrence in picture quality? i find the when i use mine on a 14in portable i get quite a good picture with good color thru a rgb scart cable is it worth getting a diffrent model aes or is the picture quality not that diffrent between models
my main tv is a 32in sony wega which i do not use with my aes as the picture looks streched and pixallated

Shito · Jun 30, 2003

rudekid:
i have a pro pow 3 serial 115549 is there a big diffrence in picture quality? i find the when i use mine on a 14in portable i get quite a good picture with good color thru a rgb scart cable is it worth getting a diffrent model aes or is the picture quality not that diffrent between models
my main tv is a 32in sony wega which i do not use with my aes as the picture looks streched and pixallated

Basically, latest NeoGeo generate a sort of 'frame grid' on gfx output which cause the picture to seems very grany/pixelated on larger screens.

Older systems had better picture output, that's it.

Lovecraft0110 · Jun 30, 2003

I think it would also be safe to assume that there may well be a lot of individual variation among systems belonging to similar "periods". I have had two AES systems so far, both with very low serial numbers, and both PAL 60, and the picture quality of them was noticeably different, if very good in both cases.

PS: long time no see, Winston!

Pep · Jun 30, 2003

Well, actually I own a Jap 330.xxx system, very high serial, bought brand new a year and a half ago, and certainly the picture looks very pixelated. I use RGB

In fact, I remember thinking that something was wrong when I first turned the system on, since I was used to other Neos and mostly to my CD system. It looks like if the system displays the image with too much definition, like seeing the game through a magnifying lent.

I also compared it with an older Pal system and the image looked less pixelated but also darker...

Depending on the game, the pixel effect is much more evident, but finally you get quite used to it. Now I must receive two lower serial systems, so I will compare their respective RGB signals.

TriShield · Jun 30, 2003

Forgive my ignorance, but how are you guys getting RGB out of the home consoles?

HPMAN · Jun 30, 2003

TriShield:
Forgive my ignorance, but how are you guys getting RGB out of the home consoles?

Plug an RGB cable into the system then hook the TV set... spock

TriShield · Jun 30, 2003

HPMAN:
Plug an RGB cable into the system then hook the TV set... spock

Thanks for elaborating Captain Obvious.

Doesn't the home console require some modifications, and what telelvisions support RGB connections?

Lovecraft0110 · Jun 30, 2003

TriShield:
Forgive my ignorance, but how are you guys getting RGB out of the home consoles?

Simple, use a SCART RGB cable to connect the home console to a EUROPEAN TV and you're all set... :rolleyes:

HPMAN · Jun 30, 2003

AAAAAAAH, the luxury of european TV sets

TriShield · Jul 1, 2003

HPMAN:
AAAAAAAH, the luxury of european TV sets

As I suspected. :o frown

NEOGEOman · Jul 1, 2003

Here's a breakdown of what Neo units have what quality output, referring to serial numbers and regarding RGB, composite + S-video mods:

<a href="http://www.gamesx.com/avpinouts/neoav.htm" target="_blank">http://www.gamesx.com/avpinouts/neoav.htm</a>

As for getting RGB from consoles, a quick google check will show nearly all modern consoles output RGB happily, the exceptions coming to mind are few: 3DO, SNESjr, N64, US/JP GameCube.

[ July 01, 2003, 10:12 PM: Message edited by: NEOGEOman ]

Talen · Jul 2, 2003

Well, the RGB variation seems to be in the revision of the sony CX chip. I've got two systems here from varying ends of the serial spectrum both of which appear to have identical rgb (jpn rgb cable to xrgb2) output after bypassing the video encoder's rgb passthrough. I'll post specifics when it's not 3 am. wink

NEOGEOman · Jul 2, 2003

Well, the RGB variation seems to be in the revision of the sony CX chip.

I'd be very surprised if this was the case. I had always assumed it was a problem with the supporting componentry for the Sony encoder. Of course, I've never actually CHECKED... =)

Earlier AES = better quality

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