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View Full Version : REPRODUCING RARE carts,neogeo scene is changing..now about to go..



FTL
11-15-2001, 02:49 PM
It seems that !arcade! followers CAN'T understand the real danger hidden in REPRODUCING rare home carts.

1)!arcade! says" time to unload your precious collection"
More,"we will put in ONE alteration"

2)Well,none bad mouthed !arcade! yet,we only warned about the REAL NEED that home made home carts be different from original one,CLEARLY DIFFERENT.
If the "one alteration" was the writings !arcade! INSIDE the boards of the cart..wow!,no one will see ANY difference at all and that would be really worse that NGF thing.
IF,OTHERWISE,the difference is easy to see,well all is ok.

From !arcade! is necessary a sign in that direction.

Infact,AS I SAID many times,NONE doubts !arcade! but what about reselling a perfect copy declaring it as a real thing.

More,real collectors will be really suspicious about many super rare carts popping out...

GA,DSD and others are NOT real SNK fans,otherwise they would feel the danger and will ask !arcade! about that.

But hey,how cool is to own a fake Ultimate 11 for $300?
Lacklustersales of the Metal Slug 1 converted carts clearly show up that only not officially released carts sell well.

Anyway,when !arcade! put up pics of his U 11,TSS,Kizuna,if they look the same of the originals..well it will be worse than NGF.
All collectors share my point of view

And only collectors wants rare game.
Players don't give a damn about U 11 ,Kizuna euro and TSS home cart.

Joe McCabe
11-15-2001, 02:58 PM
I would like Ray to reproduce the rare carts with no alterations. I would like to a US KE without spending $3000. If Ray can do, more power to him. With the reproductions, prices will hopefully fall.

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by Joe McCabe:
<STRONG>I would like Ray to reproduce the rare carts with no alterations. I would like to a US KE without spending $3000. If Ray can do, more power to him. With the reproductions, prices will hopefully fall.</STRONG>

Even if SNK is dead,reproducing rare carts CLEARLY breaks the copyrights and it's TOTALLY ILLEGAL.

Damn,Joe,why can't you see the value of what is SNK original?
Why MS 1 by !arcade! sells in a poor way at $299 and MS 1 original SNK seels for $1300+?

The point is that the real value is SNK original stuff.

Anyway,the community of REAL collectors is tight and they won't fall in a trap by some smart reseller who bought cheap from arcade and will try to sell as the real thing..

But I see the support on this topic is very low:
DSD raises his voices only about NGF..other members really don't care about it since maybe they have complete collection..

But it will come a day that many will regret corrupting the neogeo collecting in such way...

BRANDI
11-15-2001, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>It seems that !arcade! followers CAN'T understand the real danger hidden in REPRODUCING rare home carts.

1)!arcade! says" time to unload your precious collection"
More,"we will put in ONE alteration"

2)Well,none bad mouthed !arcade! yet,we only warned about the REAL NEED that home made home carts be different from original one,CLEARLY DIFFERENT.
If the "one alteration" was the writings !arcade! INSIDE the boards of the cart..wow!,no one will see ANY difference at all and that would be really worse that NGF thing.
IF,OTHERWISE,the difference is easy to see,well all is ok.

From !arcade! is necessary a sign in that direction.

Infact,AS I SAID many times,NONE doubts !arcade! but what about reselling a perfect copy declaring it as a real thing.

More,real collectors will be really suspicious about many super rare carts popping out...

GA,DSD and others are NOT real SNK fans,otherwise they would feel the danger and will ask !arcade! about that.

But hey,how cool is to own a fake Ultimate 11 for $300?
Lacklustersales of the Metal Slug 1 converted carts clearly show up that only not officially released carts sell well.

Anyway,when !arcade! put up pics of his U 11,TSS,Kizuna,if they look the same of the originals..well it will be worse than NGF.
All collectors share my point of view

And only collectors wants rare game.
Players don't give a damn about U 11 ,Kizuna euro and TSS home cart.</STRONG>

Words of wisdom, as usual... <IMG SRC="smilies/cool.gif" border="0">

Caris Nautilus
11-15-2001, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by BRANDI:
<STRONG>Words of wisdom, as usual... <IMG SRC="smilies/cool.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

sucking up, as ushual

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:12 PM
Caris,what about a useful reply?

Rarehero,I hear you well...

Joe McCabe
11-15-2001, 03:13 PM
Damn,Joe,why can't you see the value of what is SNK original?

Because I am not stupid enough to pay $3000 for a damn videogame. Who cares if it's SNK original or not. I don't. But I wouldn't pay $400 for Ray's reproduction.

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:17 PM
Joe,
you got anyway the point.
A reproduction is worth $100 or little more since it's a copy and nothing more.
But you must admit that an ORIGINAL one holds really avalue,EVEN IF you wouldn't pay $1 for it.

Big Bruno
11-15-2001, 03:21 PM
FTL,

it is not a big issue for the reason that there will be a difference.

You can turn a savage reign NGH into A kizuna fairly simply provided you had the artwork to copy but you can always tell the real deal from a copy. Exspecial if you Intentional make a minor change on the layout.

Now if arcade was coping the materials exactly and selling them as orginal then there would be a problem.

but I am sure you will be able to notice this from the outside of the box.

if you are concerned about people selling the NGH's as orginals, well you will have that problem even if they change the artwork from someone simply scanning the inserts and manuals of an orginal. I have recieved several HK NGCD's and a couple of scan labled NGH and insert NGH's because of this before !arcade!

Metal slug is a prime example of that. so as a collector you would have to be careful and well informed on the difference.

as a gamer it is great to have the option if you want the game in NGH but do not want to pay the price for the orginal.

NGF takes orginals collectable NGH's and destroys there value by putting thier hype on it and would also take that same NGH that is converted and sell it as orginal.
There is no comparasion and that is the difference.

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 03:22 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Even if SNK is dead,reproducing rare carts CLEARLY breaks the copyrights and it's TOTALLY ILLEGAL.
</STRONG>

How do you know !Arcade! doesnt have permission from the developers?

I seriously dont think people will be "mislead" by thinking the !Arcade! version for the original. If ass hole sellers decide to lie and state that the cart is original, then its their ass on the line, not !Arcades!.

I still dont understand why this is such a huge deal with collectors. You all will still be looking for originals, and avoid the reproductions. Its not like this is the first thing to ever be reporduced. Comic books, baseball cards, antiques, books, furniture. etc etc etcc have had reproductions made. Its not like its a new thing. Collectors still look for the originals and know a reproduction if they see it. Perfect example is Antique Roadshow.

I seriously doubt anyone who is willing to spend $1000+ on a cart will not look and ask if it is a reproduction. Collectors already do that with NGF stuff. People will know what they are buying... If I was willing to fork over the cash for high end games, I guarantee I would be asking all the questions. People arent that stupid... or maybe they are...

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:24 PM
More,hunting down for rare carts is the REAL fun in the neogeo home carts world,but maybe the matter will sound better so:

Blazing stars will be worth $199 or so,if it will be perfectlt duplicated
Pulstar the same
Magical drop 3 the same

and so on.

Now,to quote !arcade!, ...you all can begin to unload your rare home carts,US or jap.

Big Bruno
11-15-2001, 03:25 PM
I think you being overly concerned.

as I stated Metal slug has been available as a converted NGH for a long time now. and how much has the orginals NGH version dropped.

do you not think the same will apply to U11 or Kizuna?

Geddon_jt
11-15-2001, 03:30 PM
First let me say that I agree with everything Big Bruno Said.

FTL, there is no reason to be so concerned. These carts are not going to be marketed towards collectors like you.
People who are willing to pay $900 for a Twinkle Star Sprites are paying that price ONLY because it is a legitimate copy. Whether or not there are better, cheaper alternatives to paying this price is irrelevant because there are only a few real, authentic, scarce AES copies of this game.

!Arcade!'s new carts will appeal to those who want Twinkle Star Sprites in their AES collection, but not as a "collectors" piece, but rather to simply have the game on AES. In my opinion these games will not affect the value of the authentic games in the eyes of true collectors like yourself.

Caris Nautilus
11-15-2001, 03:32 PM
It's not gonna effect anything! Metal Slug 1 has proved this, you can get a converted cart from many places, that looks just as cool as the original, yet US slug 1's still go for a grand + on ebay.

Also !Arcade! isn't exactly making thousands of these games here, he's making what, like runs of around 50? Yea that's really gonna "crash" the scene.

The prices for originals won't go down till the demand does, re-prints won't effect people wanting originals, if anyone hasn't noticed, there already is a cheaper alternative, it's called MVS carts, Slug 1's are what 50? Last time I checked their is an MVS converter for the home system...

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: Drift King EX ]

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by Big Bruno:
[QB]FTL,

Now if arcade was coping the materials exactly and selling them as orginal then there would be a problem.

but I am sure you will be able to notice this from the outside of the box.

QB]

Big Bruno,
how could I tell the difference form original one and a perfect reproduction?
!arcade! CAN make perfect reproduction,not like those jerks at NGF.
I mean,their copy of US Kizuna is very funny and it's easy to spot the difference.
But what if you CAN'T spot the difference?

The ONLY way is that there be a difference,BIG alteration so you can see it's a fake.
Sine it's only a fake after all,no matters how good the reproduction is,it's a fake home carts.

NTM: it's really hard to believe that.
It's amazing how pople are ready to belive about impossible thing.

GamersAbyss
11-15-2001, 03:35 PM
!Arcade! will not misrepresent the cart when it is sold the first time. after that it is up to the individual re-saler to be honest in the transaction. You bring up my name in this post and I dont know why?

I am all for the common guy being able to play Video Games, not the ultra Rich!! If them reproducing Neo carts fucks up your "Investment" You should have known better in the first place. Video Games are not an investment they are entertainment!!

I have said this before and I will say it again, anyone who buys a Video Game as an "Investment" should have thier head examined!!! Play the games and enjoy them. Because if you think you are going to get rich one day because you own a "Rare" Neo Geo cart then you are very mistaken.

GA isnt a true SNK fan? Why is that? Because I dont believe in pissing my money away to a dead God, or handing it out like a fool to someone like Shawn or NGF for something they paid half of what they are asking for it? Those are the ones who arent the Fans!! Keeping the price so high the common "Working Man" cant afford to take food from his kids mouth for a $800 Home Cart. These individuals and the "Investment" collectors are the ones who really killed SNK by keeping the Neo Geo out of the hands of the common man with insane pricing and pricelists.

In short I am for the gamer and love of the hobby not the dollar amount.

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:48 PM
Originally posted by GamersAbyss:
<STRONG>!Arcade! will not misrepresent the cart when it is sold the first time. after that it is up to the individual re-saler to be honest in the transaction. You bring up my name in this post and I dont know why?

</STRONG>
I bring up your name as you seem to be a great supporter for them.
The fact,GA that if Arcade will do the right thing will have to AVOID potential reselling scam..do you get what I mean?

I'm for the games and not for the dollars.
But I'm not for the scams.

Gamers WILL be happy with a home made cart DIFFERENT in a clear way from the original.

You know,it seems more likely to happen to make money REPRODUCING in identical way rare home carts..think about it.

FTL
11-15-2001, 03:54 PM
Geddon,
what if a real collector can't see if he is buying a copy or an original due to PERFECT reproduction and due to the fact that HE HAS NEVER SEEN AN OFFICIAL U 11 US or KIZUNA euro?

Should I pay an expertize like for a rare and precious gem?

Better leaving the scene instead of this pain.
Collecting one time was a pleasure.

GA: I don't really care about money in vg and you know,I would like the neogeo scene would remain as it was before .

Big Bear you said words of wisdom.
The scene is totally dark..bootlegs,NGF,and NOW fake home carts ready to rumble.

Geddon_jt
11-15-2001, 04:00 PM
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;
Geddon,
what if a real collector can't see if he is buying a copy or an original due to PERFECT reproduction and due to the fact that HE HAS NEVER SEEN AN OFFICIAL U 11 US or KIZUNA euro?
Should I pay an expertize like for a rare and precious gem?

Better leaving the scene instead of this pain.
Collecting one time was a pleasure.
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;


Well, my intuition says that !Arcade! will have a sense of decency and respect for the hobby that will prevent him from making perfect reproductions. I have a feeling all of his carts will be properly "watermarked."

As for the scene being DARK, yes, but as a collector, look at it this way. Think about how more precious your own authentic carts will be knowing that you have located them in a sea of illegitimate merchandise. And I believe long time collectors like yourself have the skills necessary to identify even seemingly perfect fake reproductions.

rumbl3
11-15-2001, 04:03 PM
HELL YEAH i hope that !arcade! makes exact reproductions of all the rare or uncommon carts games. cuz i do not want to spend a million dollars buying games and hunting them down. i am in this for the love of neo games and to collect them all reguardless of price value (prefferbly cheap! lol) cuz not all of us have millions to blow away on a a game that is a $1000 bucks. and at that fact some of the games u find once in a blue moon then u have to pray u got the money for it. the only thing i think is that !arcade! should make the carts with somethin on the outside of it so u can tell its not a real one. so i am all for it GIVE ME REPRODUCED CARTS OR GIVE ME MONEY!!!!!!! lol <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Geddon,
what if a real collector can't see if he is buying a copy or an original due to PERFECT reproduction and due to the fact that HE HAS NEVER SEEN AN OFFICIAL U 11 US or KIZUNA euro?</STRONG>

Well the thing is a realNeo collector or any collector in any type of hobby does research and work on trying to find out where the item came from & tries to discover any differences.


Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Should I pay an expertize like for a rare and precious gem?</STRONG>

It's up to you really but I think you're still blowing this out of whack considering this type of stuff has been done for years.


Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Better leaving the scene instead of this pain.
Collecting one time was a pleasure.</STRONG>

Yeah it used to be ask yourself this. Why do you think some of us stuck through NGF's bullshit for so long? We stayed around to enjoy the hobby for its games. I've always been more a gamer than collector and the people who know me realize I speak freely about wanting everyone to enjoy the Neo & it's games.

If I was totally disgusted by something in the scene I wouldn't quit. I would just go on about my business and keep playing. In the end all your griping about this isn't going to mean a hill of beans as long as people who are smart in their purchasing on Neo games then this should not be a problem. <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">


Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>GA: I don't really care about money in vg and you know,I would like the neogeo scene would remain as it was before .</STRONG>

Oh hell no!!!
I.mot sure what you mean as before but even tho I don't agree with a lot of things Shawn has done but I prefer this kinda of thing right now compared to the Dion days when he used to have his thump up everyone's asses saying 'I AM NEOGEO' and everyone was stupid for not trusting his word when he said every single Neo Game was made on AES. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">


Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Big Bear you said words of wisdom.
The scene is totally dark..bootlegs,NGF,and NOW fake home carts ready to rumble.</STRONG>

Well SNK is gone and what do you expect to happen? There is a demand & want for these games still and SNK can not fill this void.

!Arcade! will already tell you straight up that the cart is a conversion and not an original AES so there's that.

It's upto the people who buy those games and resell it to keep that same level of honesty.

As far as NGF, Well Dion & Chris's history speaks for itself. They arn't even a real factor anymore.

Oh in case you guys are unaware I know that asshole Chris is still contacting people in emails offering services. So let me say this.

Even what he offers to you seems too good to be true, DON'T DEAL WITH HIS ASS. Period.

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: BonusKun ]

Wolf
11-15-2001, 04:10 PM
I agree with FTL on this subject. !Arcade!, PLEASE watermark your carts or put your url in the manual. Do SOMETHING to differentiate. I just don't want to make a significant investment only find out that I have been ripped off at a later date.

FTL
11-15-2001, 04:11 PM
Thoughts I got from a great and expert collector :

"Unfortunately, it may be hard to tell if Ray Young made a fake game. NGF
got caught with fake English KOF 2000 for stupid reasons. First they used a
sticker with square corners, while SNK cart stickers use rounded corners.
Second, there were some differences in the manual, like a couple missing
pictures, or a picture in the wrong spot. These were noticeable with the
naked eye and led to an in depth analysis by a member of Neo-Geo.com,
Kiselgof I believe. He put the game under a microscope and noticed many
other inconsistencies such as a different paper stock than SNK games, and a
different printing method. These discrepancies are not detectable by the
naked eye, or touch. Ray Young is smart. If he were to produce fake games,
he would certainly not make errors that could be seen or felt. If someone
has the ambition, they might do an analysis like Kiselgof, but the average
person cannot or will not do that. A good fake could probably be introduced
easily. The only good thing is that the Neo scene is pretty tight. Most
collectors will be skeptical of 3 copies of the rarest game just popping up
like that. I know I am."

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>Oh in case you guys are unaware I know that asshole Chris is still contacting people in emails offering services. So let me say this.

</STRONG>

Services you say...? Fuck that, I dont
swing that way.

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Thoughts I got from a great and expert collector :

"Unfortunately, it may be hard to tell if Ray Young made a fake game. NGF
got caught with fake English KOF 2000 for stupid reasons. First they used a
sticker with square corners, while SNK cart stickers use rounded corners.
Second, there were some differences in the manual, like a couple missing
pictures, or a picture in the wrong spot. These were noticeable with the
naked eye and led to an in depth analysis by a member of Neo-Geo.com,
Kiselgof I believe. He put the game under a microscope and noticed many
other inconsistencies such as a different paper stock than SNK games, and a
different printing method. These discrepancies are not detectable by the
naked eye, or touch. Ray Young is smart. If he were to produce fake games,
he would certainly not make errors that could be seen or felt. If someone
has the ambition, they might do an analysis like Kiselgof, but the average
person cannot or will not do that. A good fake could probably be introduced
easily. The only good thing is that the Neo scene is pretty tight. Most
collectors will be skeptical of 3 copies of the rarest game just popping up
like that. I know I am."</STRONG>

So this is a questions of Ray's integrity here or are you suggesting soemthing else?

!Arcade!
11-15-2001, 04:17 PM
"Thoughts I got from a great and expert collector"

Now that's funny!

Best Regards
!Arcade!

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Ray Young is smart. If he were to produce fake games,
he would certainly not make errors that could be seen or felt.</STRONG>

That would be counterfiting. I dont think !Arcade is in the buisness of ripping off the consumer with counterfit carts. That is NGF's job. Lets not start some bull shit mass paranoia.

FTL
11-15-2001, 04:22 PM
The problem is NOT Ray Young honesty.
He will fairly declare his production,I'm sure.

But what it will happen after his home carts,perfectly reproduced will be floating around.

It will be a problem about people's honesty.

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>That would be counterfiting. I dont think !Arcade is in the buisness of ripping off the consumer with counterfit carts. That is NGF's job. Lets not start some bull shit mass paranoia.</STRONG>

Agreed. It seems a lot of people thrive off this "proof' thing in the Neo Scene so let's hear some proof that somebody bought a cart from !Arcade! and was told by them it was original yet when they got the item it was fake?

Anyone?

Nope I didn't think so...

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Thoughts I got from a great and expert collector :

"Unfortunately, it may be hard to tell if Ray Young made a fake game. NGF
got caught with fake English KOF 2000 for stupid reasons. First they used a
sticker with square corners, while SNK cart stickers use rounded corners.
Second, there were some differences in the manual, like a couple missing
pictures, or a picture in the wrong spot. These were noticeable with the
naked eye and led to an in depth analysis by a member of Neo-Geo.com,
Kiselgof I believe. He put the game under a microscope and noticed many
other inconsistencies such as a different paper stock than SNK games, and a
different printing method. These discrepancies are not detectable by the
naked eye, or touch. Ray Young is smart. If he were to produce fake games,
he would certainly not make errors that could be seen or felt. If someone
has the ambition, they might do an analysis like Kiselgof, but the average
person cannot or will not do that. A good fake could probably be introduced
easily. The only good thing is that the Neo scene is pretty tight. Most
collectors will be skeptical of 3 copies of the rarest game just popping up
like that. I know I am."</STRONG>

You know the more I read over this text and look at the style in comparasion to other people I know who make such posts.

I'm willing to guess this this piece of advice was written by someone here who probably has a very large collection and of course thought at one time NGF carts were legit SNK made games? <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 04:46 PM
C'mon Bonus Shawn wouldn't stoop so, oh, nevermind. http://www.angelfire.com/on3/sabirocks/geese_taunt.gif

Joe McCabe
11-15-2001, 04:48 PM
Rasa I agree that Dr Who swings that way. <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 04:54 PM
Originally posted by Neo Rasa:
<STRONG>C'mon Bonus Shawn wouldn't stoop so, oh, nevermind. http://www.angelfire.com/on3/sabirocks/geese_taunt.gif </STRONG>

Heh. Don't know if it was Shawn or not but whoever this expert collector is. He needs to grow a pair and speak for himself instead of letting other people do it for him.

No offense FTL but that person's words hold no weight if they have to hide while speaking their mind.

Big Bruno
11-15-2001, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Big Bruno,
how could I tell the difference form original one and a perfect reproduction?
!arcade! CAN make perfect reproduction,not like those jerks at NGF.
I mean,their copy of US Kizuna is very funny and it's easy to spot the difference.
But what if you CAN'T spot the difference?

The ONLY way is that there be a difference,BIG alteration so you can see it's a fake.
Sine it's only a fake after all,no matters how good the reproduction is,it's a fake home carts.

NTM: it's really hard to believe that.
It's amazing how pople are ready to belive about impossible thing.</STRONG>

I would imagine arcade will tell what the difference is on the cart. if anything it will have www.neogeousa.com (http://www.neogeousa.com) or something on it in a location and before any collector plops down big money for a TSS or U11 or Kizuna they will want to see that area in a photo.

anyone spending big bucks on a NGH as with any large dollar purchase wants to at least see a photo of the merchandise first. At least I would hope so.

16-bit
11-15-2001, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>Agreed. It seems a lot of people thrive off this "proof' thing in the Neo Scene so let's hear some proof that somebody bought a cart from !Arcade! and was told by them it was original yet when they got the item it was fake?

Anyone?

Nope I didn't think so...</STRONG>

Simone laid out his argument fairly clearly. The concern is not !Arcades! integrity, but the integrity of the purchaser.

For example: say I buy a Ninja Masters !Arcade! relase that is virtually identical to the real deal. Then I take it to a local gameshop or someone just getting into the and sell it off as the real deal. People will get hurt by this.

BTW, Bonuskun I was over on Arcade's forum and noticed your post:

"And a lot of us *myself inculded* have argued that the SNK Neo*Geo was a system that should be enjoyed by everyone and not just collectors."

Have you ever heard of MVS? For under $500 you can get a phantom1, TSS MVS, Kisuna MVS, Metal Slug MVS, and Ninja Masters MVS. In relation to current systems (i.e. PS2, XBOX, etc.) I would consider price NOT to be a barrier to entry. So please clear this up for me when you mention &lt;b&gt;"system...to be enjoyed"&lt;/b&gt;:

Are you refering to the &lt;b&gt;inserts, case and instructions&lt;/b&gt;?

or are you refering to the &lt;b&gt; Games&lt;/b&gt;?

Carlson

Wan-Fu
11-15-2001, 05:04 PM
Well I think this is an expected move from Mr. Young who is above all else a shrewd businessman. He does not care about collectors or gamers per say, but will cater to either if he stands to profit by it.

The Strikers 1945 release with the numbered foiled stamps was for the collectors. However, a gamer could just as easily get the game at $399 which was a fairly reasonable price afterall. Then again gamers could decide to buyer the cheaper MVS version. In this scenario, both gamers and collectors only benefited.

However, with the recent news regarding the reproduction of rare AES titles, I am not sure what Mr. Young's intended audience might be. The purist collectors will always want the authentic SNK stuff and wont touch these games. Moreover, I doubt gamers will spend $300-400 for obscure titles like Kizuna and Ultimate 11 when a more affordable alternative exists on MVS format.

So, who is likely to buy these re-released titles? I think it will be the people who would like to have a complete collection but due to financial or personal reasons have decided to pass on the originals. Such people often view the purist collectors with scorn and disdain as this thread bears evidence.

People get into the NEO GEO scene for a variety of different reasons. We all support(ed) SNK in our own way when we bought the games. What we do with those games from that point on is up to the individual. The fact that you can play these games does not change the fact that they are still part of someone's collection; this is actually one of the endearing aspects of NEO GEO collecting.

To sum things up, I feel that if the re-release of these titles is not handled with care, it will lead to further bastardization of the NEO GEO scene. Lets hope that Mr. Young makes some meaningful alterations in his products. Here are a couple of ideas: replace the SNK logo on the spine with !Arcade! or replace the SNK copyright on the lower back of the insert with !Arcade! information.

FTL
11-15-2001, 05:06 PM
That person whose I reprted the thought is NOT Shawn.

It was tatally my decision to post those words since I feel it summarizes very well the situation.
The person who said those things to me plays no role in this topic .

I quoted that since I,repeat I, appreciated that person.

Despite of who,if you concentrate on the message you will get a good alet and a nice gaze on the situation.

Kyokugen Star
11-15-2001, 05:07 PM
As a collector myself I`m fully behind FTL on this topic. No doubt that Ray Young will declare his merchandise as unofficial/Conversion. But the real danger hides afterwards! You can bet a dollar to a doughnut that soon after the ebay auctions offering "Kizuna US AES mint" and the like will start providing the copy will be good enough not to be spotted as such on a pic.
There simply are enouh dishonest sellers - why give them the chance to offer those games? I was perfectly O.K. with converting unreleased carts (hell I even ordered a Strikers from Ray myself) but reproducing official AES scares me and threatens the collector`s market. Let`s just hope !Arcade! will clearly mark their games as being diffrent to be seen on the spot.

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 05:21 PM
Originally posted by 16-bit:
<STRONG>Simone laid out his argument fairly clearly. The concern is not !Arcades! integrity, but the integrity of the purchaser.</STRONG>

Thanks for responding about this let me offer my thoughts on it. If the concern is not !Arcade!'s integrity but the purchaser then I agree with it just fine.

Now tell me excatly in the words did Arcade say they were going to produce excat replicas on original SNK made homecarts. If Strikers 1945 plus had made a homecart and !Arcade! had reproudced it they already made one piece on the insert painfully clear that it was not an original.

Not sure if you have it but even with the Numbers & Gold Foil not there !Arcade! left one small mark to show it was not an original SNK peice of work.

As long as Arcade sticks to some slight differences in the insert with that then you should be happy right? <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">


Originally posted by 16-bit:
<STRONG>For example: say I buy a Ninja Masters !Arcade! relase that is virtually identical to the real deal. Then I take it to a local gameshop or someone just getting into the and sell it off as the real deal. People will get hurt by this.</STRONG>

Read above post.


Originally posted by 16-bit:
<STRONG>BTW, Bonuskun I was over on Arcade's forum and noticed your post:

"And a lot of us *myself inculded* have argued that the SNK Neo*Geo was a system that should be enjoyed by everyone and not just collectors."</STRONG>

Yeap that is excatly what I said with no hidden meanings. Thanks for quoting me <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">


Originally posted by 16-bit:
<STRONG>Have you ever heard of MVS? For under $500 you can get a phantom1, TSS MVS, Kisuna MVS, Metal Slug MVS, and Ninja Masters MVS. In relation to current systems (i.e. PS2, XBOX, etc.) I would consider price NOT to be a barrier to entry. So please clear this up for me when you mention &lt;b&gt;"system...to be enjoyed"&lt;/b&gt;:</STRONG>

Ah there we go trying to play like I have no idea what MVS then produce some kinda of defensive arguement to belittle it.

Have you my friend ever considered that a LOT of people outside of the scene have no damn clue what the hell you are talking about?

People can do the research like I told you before but, Some people don't want beat-up dusty ass MVS carts and would like to have a nice 'Pretty' Home cart in their collections at a fraction of the cost.

Now as to System being enjoyed let's point out something here. I meant that straight up as an open and honest statement. Why is it only collectors and people with deep pockets can enjoy SNK's System?

Oh don't give me that excuse that the Neo was a lot to begin with because that arguement is stale as hell considering the hardware is 12 years old.

The price should have hit the floor just like the 3DO did when it died out. Nowmore than ever you see people like Shawn*Yes I said the name* selling new systems for about a grand and you don't think the 2ndary market will not be effected by this?

This is a Videogame system for god's sake and trying to justify it as an investment which I see a lot of people do is stupid.

I said that statement because there are a LOT of people out there who work hard and love SNK's system yet find it hard to shell out $500.00 plus dollars for a good game or a system on the Neo.

Don't take what I said out of context or try to slice up my own words without considering they were meant with and open heart and support of the people who matter most.

The gamers not the collectors

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 05:26 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>That person whose I reprted the thought is NOT Shawn.

It was tatally my decision to post those words since I feel it summarizes very well the situation.
The person who said those things to me plays no role in this topic .

I quoted that since I,repeat I, appreciated that person.

Despite of who,if you concentrate on the message you will get a good alet and a nice gaze on the situation.</STRONG>

Get a good idea from a person who wants to hide and not say anything?

Uh huh yeah. I'm sorry but if this person wants to play this hiding game then his words don't mean jack.

He could be some kid on a street corner selling newspapers but that don't mean his word is gold.

Posting that only shoots the crediblity of the person saying that. If he can't speak for himself, Don't do it for him.

Blaine
11-15-2001, 05:31 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>The gamers not the collectors</STRONG>

Right on. It's called Ameritrade.com, check it out.

*My definition of 'collector' is someone who buys something or keeps it in good condition because he hopes it's worth something one day. I keep all of my games nice. I try to only buy complete MVS games. But that's just because I like having nice things. I have video game 'collectibles' but I don't have them as investments.*

Kage-Ryu
11-15-2001, 05:31 PM
I think both sides of the arguement are right and both have their strong points.

Yes, sadly there are dishonest people. These people would gladly take a nearly perfect reproduction and try to sell it as the "real thing" Collectors and newbies alike would be getting screwed left and right with no way of telling whats what.

However, on the other hand, people who cant afford to buy the expensive carts and or dont want to "just get MVS" have a way of playing these games. Now they dont have to pay an arm,leg, and testicle to get that kizuna encounter or whatever game they've always wanted to play.

I personally am all for !arcade! making the carts as close to the real thing as possible. From dealing with him in the past, he is very honest and upfront. It isnt his fault if someone takes the carts he made and trys to sell them as something they're not. He is only producing them and selling them as what they really are.

FTL
11-15-2001, 05:43 PM
Bonuskun:
again that person is NOT involved in the neoscene here in the forums.
But it's a great person and collector in my opinion and you know,I quoted his mind .

I totally agre with Carlson and Wanfu.
If I was to buy a TSS,I would get it form Carlson,for ex,since I know he got it from Japan.

Bonus Kun,you are speaking for the gamers,ok.
Please tell arcade to do THEIR version of the games,the neogeo scene needs all but not a flooding of fake home carts of every rare game.

16-bit
11-15-2001, 06:18 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>Ah there we go trying to play like I have no idea what MVS then produce some kinda of defensive arguement to belittle it.

[QB]Have you my friend ever considered that a LOT of people outside of the scene have no damn clue what the hell you are talking about?</STRONG>

a LOT of people do research before making car purchases, buying stocks, homes, video games systems. There is plenty of information out there for people to research.

<STRONG>People can do the research like I told you before but, Some people don't want beat-up dusty ass MVS carts and would like to have a nice 'Pretty' Home cart in their collections at a fraction of the cost.</STRONG>


Sorry, I thought gamers cared about the game-not the packaging. Seems like you are defending the collector mentality here.

<STRONG>Now as to System being enjoyed let's point out something here. I meant that straight up as an open and honest statement. Why is it only collectors and people with deep pockets can enjoy SNK's System? </STRONG>

I question your use of the word "only". Don't mean to break your spirit, but you can find USED systems at reasonable prices and most of the home carts are under $100 a piece. Bobak is a great example: he has a great homecart collection and substitutes with MVS when the cart is extremely rare or expensive. Thanks to !Arcade! a lot of us can do this, and a lot of us are.


<STRONG>Oh don't give me that excuse that the Neo was a lot to begin with because that arguement is stale as hell considering the hardware is 12 years old.</STRONG>

I won't, and many of the prices of home carts are falling: Samurai Showdown 2, 3, KOF 94-99, AOF 2, and others are continually droping in price. You feel excluded because a dusty old Twinkle Star Sprites MVS, even though fully playable on a Neo Geo with converter does not do the gamer justice.

<STRONG>he price should have hit the floor just like the 3DO did when it died out. Nowmore than ever you see people like Shawn*Yes I said the name* selling new systems for about a grand and you don't think the 2ndary market will not be effected by this?</STRONG>

Personally, I doubt one will see prices anywhere near those levels if you can be satisfied with a used system.

Neo geo is a unique and wonderful system, the paragon of 2D gaming. 3do is just another crap early gen CD based system.

<STRONG>This is a Videogame system for god's sake and trying to justify it as an investment which I see a lot of people do is stupid.

I said that statement because there are a LOT of people out there who work hard and love SNK's system yet find it hard to shell out $500.00 plus dollars for a good game or a system on the Neo. </STRONG>

That said, "there are a LOT of people out there who work hard and love yet find it hard to shell out [40,000+] for a [car].

Sorry Bonuskun, but if I am feeling cheritable, I would rather donate to a reputable charity, than satisfy someone's material void. These are video games for God's sake.

<STRONG>Don't take what I said out of context or try to slice up my own words without considering they were meant with and open heart and support of the people who matter most.

The gamers [b]not the collectors</STRONG>

You continually blur the lines between collector and gamer, yet try to clearly distiguish the two. Truth is, most of us are both. You established earlier that MVS is inferior ("beat up, dusty ass"), yet your claim to be a Gamer seems quite odd. I would think that sort of statement would only come from the mouth of a collector.

From reading the posts recently, I have had an easier time telling apart someone who has studied economics, than collector from gamer.

Carlson

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: 16-bit ]

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 06:28 PM
the neogeo scene needs all but not a flooding of fake home carts of every rare game.

If anything the scene DOES need the flooding of fakes of all rare titles unless you want the scene to eventually narrow down to consisting of Shawn, Dion Dakis, and maybe three other people sending each other picutres of their rolexes/cars/etc. Maybe people who already spent large sums of money on said rare games don't want the market to be flooded with fakes so that the prestige of their collection will be preserved but other than that what harm will it do? People will be suspcious of buying them so they won't and the prices might decrease? DEAR GOD NO!!!!!

3do is just another crap early gen CD based system.

It's also the ONLY system to have quality ports of Samurai Shodown and Super Street Fighter II Turbo, the system where straight PSX ports of Road Rash 3D (among some other games) came from, etc. Compared to the other CD offerings at the time (Philips CD-I and Sega CD) I would hardly call it just another piece of crap. There were also many unique quality games on it such as Quarantine, Solar Eclipse, Space Hulk: Vengeance of the Blood Angels, etc.

rumbl3
11-15-2001, 06:30 PM
I think some people are sort of mad cuz the fact that normal people like me (if arcade doesn't try to sell these things for a fortune) will be able to buy rare games and have them. i think it offends some of these collectors in a way. but like i said i am all for the reproduction cuz i don;t want to really buy a phantom-1 , and now that he might start reproducing some of these carts and if there cheap (wonder what the price is?) then no phantom-1 for me i'll stick to gettin the carts! HOPEFULLY HE REPRODUCES THE LAST BLADE 2!!!!!!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

chimpmeister
11-15-2001, 06:41 PM
Those of you arguing that !Arcade! will mark these reproductions to distinguish them from the originals (for games like Metal Slug, Kizuna Encounter, TSS, Pulstar, Blazing Star, etc.) are missing one major point:

If he sells the games as reproductions, he can likely get a maximum of $400 per cart, but most likely less.

If he sells the games as originals, through whatever channels, he stands to make a serious bundle of money. FAR more than if he sold them as repros.

That is a point that FTL did not come directly out and state, but that I believe could happen. Could he reproduce the carts perfectly? I believe so. Would he sell them as originals? The profit motive is certainly there . . . you make the call.

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 06:44 PM
Don't worry Shingo. If you're not well versed in arcade hardware or don't have space or an MVS cabinet and just listen to what the people say all you need is an AES sytem and converter! You can get old ones both at the Neo-Store for ONLY around $635! I think I'll buy a few dozen right now!

16-bit
11-15-2001, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by Neo Rasa:
<STRONG>[b]

It's also the ONLY system to have quality ports of Samurai Shodown and Super Street Fighter II Turbo, the system where straight PSX ports of Road Rash 3D (among some other games) came from, etc. Compared to the other CD offerings at the time (Philips CD-I and Sega CD) I would hardly call it just another piece of crap. There were also many unique quality games on it such as Quarantine, Solar Eclipse, Space Hulk: Vengeance of the Blood Angels, etc.</STRONG>

Point well taken. I stand corrected.

Carlson

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 06:48 PM
Originally posted by chimpmeister:
<STRONG>Those of you arguing that !Arcade! will mark these reproductions to distinguish them from the originals (for games like Metal Slug, Kizuna Encounter, TSS, Pulstar, Blazing Star, etc.) are missing one major point:

If he sells the games as reproductions, he can likely get a maximum of $400 per cart, but most likely less.

If he sells the games as originals, through whatever channels, he stands to make a serious bundle of money. FAR more than if he sold them as repros.

That is a point that FTL did not come directly out and state, but that I believe could happen. Could he reproduce the carts perfectly? I believe so. Would he sell them as originals? The profit motive is certainly there . . . you make the call.</STRONG>

Please, what kind of dirtbag would try to sell Neo Geo related goods at an extremely high price on the basis that it's "official"? <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">


What are these supposed channels where the supposed fake real fake carts could supposedly be sold through? Wouldn't the resources needed to set up such a venture outweigh the profits? Honestly, look at NGF. They still exist and what not but how effective were their efforts to pass off freaked games as official? Even someone were to make PERFECT copies of the games in every respect some kind of discrepincy would be found because of the paranoia already in most of you over inadvertantly devaluing your overall investment from a psychological standpoint.

Edit: np 16-bit

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: Neo Rasa ]

GamersAbyss
11-15-2001, 06:57 PM
LMAO....Rasa your a trip Man!! Yeah far be it from the common man to have a "Rare" Neo game!! You Neo collectors make me laugh, you truely do. I have well over 100 Neo games MVS, AES, and CD but believe me I dont go in my office at night where they are located and sniff minty fresh baggies....LOL.

Ok lets just say you are right!! Ray it sticking in the ass of the collector and helping out the gamers? Me personally I would rather share my experiences with others less fortunate than myself.

Keep in mind people the only ones bitching about this are the greedy collectors who want to be the "Big Neo Kids on the Block" and look "Official" and the "Big Tymers".

You say I am a big supporter of !Arcade!, You bet I am!!! The Phantom 1 brought the Neo to a whole new level and gave many gamers the chance to play games they could not afford on the AES format. !Arcade! has done the Neo gamers a favor and all you can do is bitch.

I think we should all Thank !Arcade! for keeping the scene alive and giving the common man the opportunaty to play games that only the "Investment" "Collector" "Elite" had the chance to play before they hit the scene.

chimpmeister
11-15-2001, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by Neo Rasa:
<STRONG>Please, what kind of dirtbag would try to sell Neo Geo related goods at an extremely high price on the basis that it's "official"? <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">


What are these supposed channels where the supposed fake real fake carts could supposedly be sold through? Wouldn't the resources needed to set up such a venture outweigh the profits? Honestly, look at NGF. They still exist and what not but how effective were their efforts to pass off freaked games as official? Even someone were to make PERFECT copies of the games in every respect some kind of discrepincy would be found because of the paranoia already in most of you over inadvertantly devaluing your overall investment from a psychological standpoint.

Edit: np 16-bit

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: Neo Rasa ]</STRONG>

I agree that some very subtle discrepancies might be found, but the repros could conceivably be very clost.

As for NGF, their reproductions were shit, inserts were very poor quality, and there were abundant signs that their carts were not original. They're not even in the same league, remotely.

All I am saying is that the profit motive is there, and selling near-perfect repros AS repros would not be NEARLY as profitable as selling them as originals. As for what channels, I'm certain that anyone intelligent enough to produces carts at this quality level, could figure out a way to funnel them into the market, in a discreet manner.

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 07:05 PM
As for what channels, I'm certain that anyone intelligent enough to produces carts at this quality level, could figure out a way to funnel them into the market, in a discreet manner.

That's what I mean though, it would have to be so discreet and gradual that it wouldn't be an effective way to make money in the first place. It would be easier and more profitable in the long run to sell the reproductions up front as reproductions and through that service gain some long term customers.

GamersAbyss
11-15-2001, 07:14 PM
Ok now I am going to fuckin really speak up here!!! HERE IS THE FUCKIN FACTS!!

!Arcade! is going to near own the Neo scene with some of the revolutionary shit they are doing and Shawn has sent out his bitches to try and discredit them!! You Fucks Blow!!

Get over it because it is not going to happen and the reputation of !Arcade! is impeckable unlike the reputation of so many other Neo dealers in the scene!!

Whats the matter Shawn is the competition getting to steep for your Royal blood?

Ok now that I said that lets have all those GA is a spy for !Arcade! posts!!! No wait!! GA=Tull Pray....LMAO

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 07:17 PM
My final opinion...

It all comes down to the ethics and credibility of !Arcade!. I have never had any reason to think they have criminal intenetions on the reproductions. They, like tons of other companies, are reproducing a expensive and sought after product. Wether it be perfect, or slightly altered, it is done all the time and by a lot of people.

Collectors: Your beating a dead horse on this issue trying to convince non-collectors that this is evil.

Non-collectors: Your beating a dead horse on this issue trying to convince collectors that this is not evil.

Wether you hate it or not, it is coming.... I for one, think it is a good thing. I see why collectors are concerned, but I just dont see it your way.

Wether it be comics, antiques, WHATEVER, reproductions exist everywhere for everything, and collectors will want the originals. Making the Neo reproductions, will be no different (IMO). Serious cart collectors will know whats up....

Neo Rasa
11-15-2001, 07:25 PM
Whats the matter Shawn is the competition getting to steep for your Royal blood?

You know what they say, once you go (well TRY) monopoly you NEVER go back. <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

Maybe the heat picked up too much for www.neo-EGO.com (http://www.neo-EGO.com)

Ok now that I said that lets have all those GA is a spy for !Arcade! posts!!! No wait!! GA=Tull Pray....LMAO

You shouldn't mod #neo-geo anymore! You might be leaking info to the enemy holy fuckface there's just so much TOP SECRET NEWS you can get in an open irc chat! <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">

Then again with certain NG.com administrative personell accidentally posting their handle passwords in public you never know! <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0">

rumbl3
11-15-2001, 07:32 PM
why is it that everyone always tries to call someone a criminal around here. someone tries to do a good deed in my opinion keep this system alive, and then u get the people that bitch and sit here and debate weither there a theif or not when they haven;t done any wrong to begin with. Then u got the hard-core neo aes collectors that got there fuckin thongs in a bundle cuz us commoners have a chance at some hard to get titles for cheap now. and gamerabyess i don't really want to buy a phanton-1 thats why i am hopeing his reproductions are cheap. cuz i would just rather have the carts much easier then goin thru this buyin a phanton-1 crap. <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

GamersAbyss
11-15-2001, 07:34 PM
Rasa I would give up the spy game but then who would leak the information to Pippin? You wouldnt like to see Pippin when he is angry!!!

rumbl3
11-15-2001, 07:36 PM
ALL I WANT TO KNOW IS HOW MUCH THE CARTS WILL COST AND WHAT CARTS HE IS GOIN TO REPRODUCE!!!!!!!!!!!! AND WHEN!!!!!!!. *prays for LB2* <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

Big Bruno
11-15-2001, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by chimpmeister:
<STRONG>Those of you arguing that !Arcade! will mark these reproductions to distinguish them from the originals (for games like Metal Slug, Kizuna Encounter, TSS, Pulstar, Blazing Star, etc.) are missing one major point:

If he sells the games as reproductions, he can likely get a maximum of $400 per cart, but most likely less.

If he sells the games as originals, through whatever channels, he stands to make a serious bundle of money. FAR more than if he sold them as repros.

That is a point that FTL did not come directly out and state, but that I believe could happen. Could he reproduce the carts perfectly? I believe so. Would he sell them as originals? The profit motive is certainly there . . . you make the call.</STRONG>


Anyone can and does do that.

I think all you have to do is look at the history of the Metal Slug 1 conversions that have sold on ebay and other places. There is a market for these games.

I realize the point but I think as with baseball cards, or rare painting or anything that commands a lot of money.

The deal is someone who collects items they must be informed on what they are purchasing if not they are going to get burned. it is that way with any collectable market be it video game or otherwise.

Sure !ARCADE! can make a lot of money in the short term if they make exact copies. As anyone could. But As I was saying even a copy is going to be disginshable in some way. Converting a metal slug NGM to NGH is Easy and the parts to do it can be had for under $100. then you have $400 or more to try to make the artwork match exactly for just one cart. Someone will be able to tell the difference from it and the orginal though. Sure it makes it Harder to distingish but that is where education comes in.

for that matter someone can take a japanese, korean, us or euro version of a neo cart and change it to any language.

the Metal slug conversion sells for $299 and they make a profit on it. you can try to sell them at $1000 a pop, but how many will you sell. 7 or 8, until someone says "hey do not buy ngh's from this dealer because the are copies" . Not only did you only make cut your oppurtunity to make money but you are black listed and can not move merchandise. however a 50 NGH run per game at $400 or $300 would make a much bigger profit so what would make the most business sense.

Flooding the market with fake NGH's to be sold as orginals is a bad move. not only will the price of the orginals decrease but it is only good for a short term profit until it is discover.

there will be dishonest people but they will be around regardless.

I see FTL's point but IMO it is not one to worry or mule over.

aria
11-15-2001, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>How do you know !Arcade! doesnt have permission from the developers?
</STRONG>


Well, the legal liability is with !Arcade! to prove that they do.
But I really don't think that's the issue.

aria
11-15-2001, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by Wan-Fu:
<STRONG>Well I think this is an expected move from Mr. Young who is above all else a shrewd businessman. He does not care about collectors or gamers per say, but will cater to either if he stands to profit by it.

The Strikers 1945 release with the numbered foiled stamps was for the collectors. However, a gamer could just as easily get the game at $399 which was a fairly reasonable price afterall. Then again gamers could decide to buyer the cheaper MVS version. In this scenario, both gamers and collectors only benefited.

However, with the recent news regarding the reproduction of rare AES titles, I am not sure what Mr. Young's intended audience might be. The purist collectors will always want the authentic SNK stuff and wont touch these games. Moreover, I doubt gamers will spend $300-400 for obscure titles like Kizuna and Ultimate 11 when a more affordable alternative exists on MVS format.

So, who is likely to buy these re-released titles? I think it will be the people who would like to have a complete collection but due to financial or personal reasons have decided to pass on the originals. Such people often view the purist collectors with scorn and disdain as this thread bears evidence.

People get into the NEO GEO scene for a variety of different reasons. We all support(ed) SNK in our own way when we bought the games. What we do with those games from that point on is up to the individual. The fact that you can play these games does not change the fact that they are still part of someone's collection; this is actually one of the endearing aspects of NEO GEO collecting.

To sum things up, I feel that if the re-release of these titles is not handled with care, it will lead to further bastardization of the NEO GEO scene. Lets hope that Mr. Young makes some meaningful alterations in his products. Here are a couple of ideas: replace the SNK logo on the spine with !Arcade! or replace the SNK copyright on the lower back of the insert with !Arcade! information.</STRONG>

I think this was the strongest post in the whole thread. It was touched on, but only lightly. What is !Arcade!'s response? I think, with the Strikers 1945 numbering, there's precedent for some kind of watermark (which shouldn't diminish the !Arcade! product, if anything make it even more special).

IMO, if !Arcade! continues with this tradition, there won't be any issues on this anymore.

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: Bobak ]

chimpmeister
11-15-2001, 07:51 PM
Originally posted by Shingo:
<STRONG>why is it that everyone always tries to call someone a criminal around here. someone tries to do a good deed in my opinion keep this system alive, and then u get the people that bitch and sit here and debate weither there a theif or not when they haven;t done any wrong to begin with. Then u got the hard-core neo aes collectors that got there fuckin thongs in a bundle cuz us commoners have a chance at some hard to get titles for cheap now. and gamerabyess i don't really want to buy a phanton-1 thats why i am hopeing his reproductions are cheap. cuz i would just rather have the carts much easier then goin thru this buyin a phanton-1 crap. <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

LMAO, if you think that these re-releases will be "cheap", pass that stuff my way because it must be KILLER WEED!! <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0">

Seriously, you're looking at $400 or higher most likely . . . if you consider that "cheap" (I don't), more power to you
. . . <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 07:54 PM
Originally posted by Bobak:
<STRONG>
Well, the legal liability is with !Arcade! to prove that they do.
But I really don't think that's the issue.</STRONG>

I never intended that this is the issue. I was just addressing FTL's statement. I dont know all about the legality of converting these carts, and the subject can be beaten into the ground... I would imagine that they have permission from those developers still in buisness... but anyways, I dont want to dwell on that subject...

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 07:55 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Bonuskun:
again that person is NOT involved in the neoscene here in the forums.

But it's a great person and collector in my opinion and you know,I quoted his mind .
</STRONG>

Then if he's not involved then tell him to put a sock in it becuase we have no IDEA who he is or his credibility seeing as you are saying he's a great collector.

If he's so great tell him to say it from his own standpoint in PERSON instead of you doing it for him.

For all we know you culd mean either Shawn, Dion or Chris Ray or ANYONE this guy whom you deem so credible, Let the man speak for himself. I don't know this guy so why should me or anyone else take his words as FACT when he won't speak for himself?



Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Bonus Kun,you are speaking for the gamers,ok.
Please tell arcade to do THEIR version of the games,the neogeo scene needs all but not a flooding of fake home carts of every rare game.</STRONG>

Of course I agree with this. Which is why Arcade tells you up front it's not an original. Not once did they say they were going to duplicate home carts excatly like the original versions.

A lot of people pulled that monkey out their asses after they saw the Slug 1 then the Strikers 1945 Plus because they knew if !Arcade! was dishonest enough *WHICH they arn't* they could very much fill up the market with fake shit that only a select few with a trained eye*Nick_th_fury for example* would be able to tell if the shit was real or not.

Most of the people I see trying to beat down on this are the collectors who are trying so hard to protect something that should have NEVER been an investment to begin with.

assflounder
11-15-2001, 07:57 PM
Well Simone.....You are gonna hate to hear this , but I gotta say it anyway. I know you respect me as a collector but you need to understand my point of view on this, so hear it is. I 110% support the full duplication of the rarest carts to a "T" . Not that I'd want too see one pass as an original , but that originals are no longer worth what people are raping other people for. 3500+ for a game. That rediculous. And whoever pays it needs their head examined. Its just a game. I give the person no glory who owns it. Now you know my opinion has credibility because I paid over a grand for My US Slug and I still feel my ass for it. I want to complete my collection and I do not want to pay 50 grand to do it. So to sum it up , I hope that Ray comes through and violently drops the Bomb on the high priced neo market.
I love neo geo, but its not my God and I do not go to church sunday to worship SNK. You are a forum friend simone , so do not take this as a stab at you. Just understand the meeker side of gammers that would like to get a hold of these games. From my experiences......Ray has been nothing short of extremely helpful and trustworthy. I feel he's in this to help the neo community thrive as far as it can. Take a moment and think.......Shawn had this forum created to his site for the benifit of all us that love neo. You can see what it has done to his Neo store sales, they dropped dramatically. He had to know this , but thought to help us out. Thats a grand gesture there, just like what Ray intends to do. What is original? Something that comes from SNK themselves? Whats the difference where it comes from as long as its good. Well, I see you're point about the selling of cart for copys price. I hope all carts are drastically reduced that are rare. Thats just how I feel.

Gary.

Wolf
11-15-2001, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by assflounder:
<STRONG>Well Simone.....You are gonna hate to hear this , but I gotta say it anyway. I know you respect me as a collector but you need to understand my point of view on this, so hear it is. I 110% support the full duplication of the rarest carts to a "T" . Not that I'd want too see one pass as an original , but that originals are no longer worth what people are raping other people for. 3500+ for a game. That rediculous. And whoever pays it needs their head examined. Its just a game. I give the person no glory who owns it. Now you know my opinion has credibility because I paid over a grand for My US Slug and I still feel my ass for it. I want to complete my collection and I do not want to pay 50 grand to do it. So to sum it up , I hope that Ray comes through and violently drops the Bomb on the high priced neo market.
I love neo geo, but its not my God and I do not go to church sunday to worship SNK. You are a forum friend simone , so do not take this as a stab at you. Just understand the meeker side of gammers that would like to get a hold of these games. From my experiences......Ray has been nothing short of extremely helpful and trustworthy. I feel he's in this to help the neo community thrive as far as it can. Take a moment and think.......Shawn had this forum created to his site for the benifit of all us that love neo. You can see what it has done to his Neo store sales, they dropped dramatically. He had to know this , but thought to help us out. Thats a grand gesture there, just like what Ray intends to do. What is original? Something that comes from SNK themselves? Whats the difference where it comes from as long as its good. Well, I see you're point about the selling of cart for copys price. I hope all carts are drastically reduced that are rare. Thats just how I feel.

Gary.</STRONG>

Well said. Unfortunately, I doubt we'll see any drop in the cart prices with the release of !Arcade! versions. The number of people interested in an original copy of Metal Slug at $500 would be huge. It would never happen because someone would buy 5 copies and resell them for higher prices because the demand for original Metal Slugs is HUGE. Gamers can get a complete conversion with manual for under $300 and yet that has not dropped the price of the original. The only way prices are going down is if there is a prolonged lack of interest in the neo overall. Arcade's re-releases will do little to change prices.

Viewpoint
11-15-2001, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by Wolf:
<STRONG>Well said. Unfortunately, I doubt we'll see any drop in the cart prices with the release of !Arcade! versions. The number of people interested in an original copy of Metal Slug at $500 would be huge. It would never happen because someone would buy 5 copies and resell them for higher prices because the demand for original Metal Slugs is HUGE. Gamers can get a complete conversion with manual for under $300 and yet that has not dropped the price of the original. The only way prices are going down is if there is a prolonged lack of interest in the neo overall. Arcade's re-releases will do little to change prices.</STRONG>

I agree with that totally. At least now people will have a choice. Which is something I fully support. Having a monopoly which NGF tried to do shows just how greedy some people can be.

There may be hope yet. Who knows?

Herzog Drei
11-15-2001, 09:08 PM
Originally posted by Wolf:
<STRONG>Well said. Unfortunately, I doubt we'll see any drop in the cart prices with the release of !Arcade! versions. The number of people interested in an original copy of Metal Slug at $500 would be huge. It would never happen because someone would buy 5 copies and resell them for higher prices because the demand for original Metal Slugs is HUGE. Gamers can get a complete conversion with manual for under $300 and yet that has not dropped the price of the original. The only way prices are going down is if there is a prolonged lack of interest in the neo overall. Arcade's re-releases will do little to change prices.</STRONG>


Agree with that,too!
But now at least there are the (still) rare originals(may the collectors fight 'to the death' over them <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> ),
and a well made,reasonable priced(OK,it's strange to call $300-$400 'reasonable',but it sure beats $1200) AES alternative.

One for the 'gamers' and one for the 'collectors'...

Why isn't everybody satisfied??? <IMG SRC="smilies/confused.gif" border="0">

All this bickering...
The only BAD thing that could have happened is that !Arcade! would try to sell their stuff as real for the collectors prices-and they hardly would do that because in that case
THEY NEVER WOULD HAVE ANNOUNCED THOSE 'REMAKES'!
They had kept their mouth shut,sold a few of them on E-bay under different names,maybe one or two on their own site.....

...so a thread like THIS HERE would never have existed!

Since they sell their stuff themselves,there is no need to buy from somebody else who might try to get the collectors price...

And any collector willing to spend $1000/or higher simply HAS to be mature enough to know his stuff-the least thing he can do is to post a question about it on this very site!

assflounder
11-15-2001, 09:36 PM
Nope , I disagree that people will sell them as an original. Because Ray can duplicate it exactly ,there would be no difference. No difference. So all Metal Slugs Prior to this version would drop in price. Thats right, only the owner would see value in it. To sell it or any version, and I know not why I say version because an exact copy is not a version , its to me the real deal too, anyway , will not be worth anymore than any other. Got a US slug? Think you can still get a 1000 or more for it? By all means. I know I will never pay a silly price like that again. 500 is the most I will spend on a cart. And I may not even pay that much. It all came to me as I Duplicated a US slug Myself. I had everything perfect except the type of paper The insert and manual uses. Even though once in the case , you could't tell the difference.

[ November 15, 2001: Message edited by: assflounder ]

smurphy570
11-15-2001, 10:30 PM
HEY Ray is helping out.. More reproduction the better...Who really cares in the value? Everything decrease in values I have comics and baseball cards that were worth hundreds now are crap. If people want to make an investment go some where else. These are video games which is suppose to mean fun. You guys that are crying about the values decreasing who cares? Have fun and enjoy the games..I have 54 aes and the reason why I buy them instead of mvs is because I always wanted the aes system as a teenager growing up, I like the boxes and inserts..If tommorrow my english motw was worth $200 or if Ray reproduced tommorrow I would bbe happy as hell, that other people could enjoy this game.
ALSO RAY IS A GOOD GUY. I have dealt with him in the past, I have brought stuff from him and he is great. For a Candian he's a good business man.
So bottom line? Go cry somewhere else, its about the games and the value.

smurphy570
11-15-2001, 10:31 PM
I love too see all the bitches cry, its fun

smurphy570
11-15-2001, 10:43 PM
oops its about the games not the values.

rarehero
11-15-2001, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Caris,what about a useful reply?

Rarehero,I hear you well...</STRONG>

good evening everyone,
i see alot of friends dropping the arguement
here so I'll try my best not to step on any
one's toes... I see both sides as very valid arguements first of all.
but i do have some pretty stong opinions about this though.
first i ll say that i am very much a gamer..
but i happen to be a collector too.
that doesnt mean i collect games to acrue value,
it means i collect games that i like.
i am very much against piracy, (this is not a reference towards conversions)
and i do not like the idea of having anthing that is not original in my collection
(that was in reference to conversions)
i love games and i pay alot for them.
im proud of my collection and even more proud
that everything i have is worth keeping
100 times over.
my NEOGEO games are quite possibly my favorites
though. maybe its a born bias of a strange
unexplainable love for a game company, but hey... its there isnt it? <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

!arcade! is an enigma to me.
but here you go.
they truely do the NEOGEO community a service.
they came out with converters which are from
what i hear, top notch and do the
wonderful feat of allowing you to play MVS games.
awsome.
they also did a great conversion no matter how
heavily critized of strikers 1945
they have done and helped many members around here
and i m sure many can atest to that.
like carlson said, !arcade!s quality of service is not being questioned here.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i really question releasing these rare carts
that are too similar to the originals.
im not speaking from the stand point of
a collector who wants MS1 to retain a 1000 dollar asking price
but from a NEOGEO customer that has to deal
with the origins of all carts now.
isnt it bad enough that we have to look for
stamps on our inserts now?
im not comparing NGFUSA to !arcade!
but i dont want to have to be weary of
close to original conversions all about.
i ve suggested this in a previous post
but !arcade! never responded to it. which of course wasnt neccessary.
it was a suggestion really.
why not make original art like the camo insert
MS1 as i said before the strikers 1945 insert
made by the fellas at !arcade! looks nice.
speaking of strikers why not just stick to unreleased carts?
if i was a person that had no thoughts about conversions
i would snatch up NitD in a heart beat. thats a great game
that otherwise would have never made it out to some people.
i truely dont really care about 1000 dollar carts but i do
know that if i ever go shoping for a twinkle star sprites which i think
is actually cool enough to almost be worth a couple hundred dollars.
then yes. i dont want to find out when i get the cart that its a
near original with a NEOGEOUSA.com url on it.
and me be in the very awkward position of trying to
fix the problem with the seller.
especially if im paying the price for it.
im an SNK purist.
i have to have the original. and im not going to pay anything for
something thats not SNK.
sorry if that sounds harsh but thats my childish point of view.
im not trying to keep the prices up..
i understand what !arcade! is trying to do.
and believe me its a noble cause.
but i have problems accepting that they will make high quality carts with art
that will be mistakened for the real thing.
the art if held next too each other can be distingushed but
otherwise would not be distinguishable to a newbie or someone
not knowledgeable about carts..
lets face it.

~not all people are honest.
and sellers may sell it intentionally in the future or unintentionally
to unsuspecting buyers.

~not all people are knowledgable about every facet of any subject.
thats why you see people asking why NGFUSA is supposed to be so
bad when dion and chris are a complete gentlemen to them.

!arcade!s done a good job of what they do.
but i think this is a bit contriversal
i dont know if its too much to ask !arcade! to look over these points
and try to answer them. after all, theyre on these boards more
often then their own im sure... <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

* change the inserts and cart art to something easily distingushiable from the original

* maybe stick to unreleased carts

reproducing the carts arent the problem
telling them apart from the real version imo is though.

all this reminds me of the korean SS4 carts.
some of these people had NEOGEO games for awhile
and been around for awhile too.
but all of a sudden everyone figured out there were problems
with the few that did not work properly.
...
h...
im trying to think if i left anything out..
if i think of more i ll let you guys know i guess <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">
thanks for listening though..
heh
this must be a record long post for me...

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: rarehero ]

NeoTurfMasta
11-15-2001, 11:41 PM
Ahh rare, SNK purist to the end. Like we have said before, if there was a dog turd on eBay that had SNK printed on it, you would buy it. I wouldnt have you any other way <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

I could care less weather Arcade duplicates the art exactly, or if it is something completely different. IMO, it wont make shit bit of difference to collectors... But hey, what do I know?

Take it leave it... There is no middle ground here it seems. Oh well, another drama filled day in the Neo scene.

rarehero
11-16-2001, 12:00 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>Ahh rare, SNK purist to the end. Like we have said before, if there was a dog turd on eBay that had SNK printed on it, you would buy it. I wouldnt have you any other way <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">
</STRONG>

<IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">
of course...
now where do i find this official dog turd you talk about....?
must be super minty fresh in the original baggie!
:P

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 12:08 AM
Originally posted by rarehero:
<STRONG> <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">
of course...
now where do i find this official dog turd you talk about....?
must be super minty fresh in the original baggie!
:P</STRONG>

Well, the closest thing I have is a Sega dog turd. I couldnt convince V to name her SNK. I can scour the neighbors back yard for super sized turds if you like. Or better yet, let me give you a Quiz King of Fighters home cart. Thats as close to a turd as I have.... <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> kidding...

rarehero
11-16-2001, 12:27 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>Or better yet, let me give you a Quiz King of Fighters home cart. </STRONG>

i ll buy that for a dollar!!

aria
11-16-2001, 12:35 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>Take it leave it... There is no middle ground here it seems. Oh well, another drama filled day in the Neo scene.</STRONG>

What???

Of course there's middle ground. The middle ground has been mentioned by several people including Wan-Fu, Rarehero, and me:

Use the same pro-quality work, only with some kind unique water mark (like the individual numbering of Strikers).

Then you'll keep the prices of those games the same, keep people from getting screwed in the resale, and help out gamers and collectors alike.

Win-win.

Am I wrong?

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 12:39 AM
Hey Ray, how about making inserts and stickers completely different, so that would be clear to spot a reproduction from the original?
This way you could make happy collectors and your customers...

aria
11-16-2001, 12:40 AM
Does it need to be totally different?

Numbering would be cool.

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Bobak ]

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 12:43 AM
Originally posted by Bobak:
<STRONG>What???

Of course there's middle ground. The middle ground has been mentioned by several people including Wan-Fu, Rarehero, and me:

Use the same pro-quality work, only with some kind unique water mark (like the individual numbering of Strikers).

Then you'll keep the prices of those games the same, keep people from getting screwed in the resale, and help out gamers and collectors alike.

Win-win.

Am I wrong?</STRONG>

I guess what I ment by that was the perfect duplication issue (which I kinda prefer). You either love it or you hate it. At least that what I was thinking at the time when I typed that. I probably should have typed more, it didnt put my complete point across. Cut me some slack. You see what sleep deprevation and long hours does to a guy.

aria
11-16-2001, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>I guess what I ment by that was the perfect duplication issue (which I kinda prefer). You either love it or you hate it. At least that what I was thinking at the time when I typed that. I probably should have typed more, it didnt put my complete point across. Cut me some slack. You see what sleep deprevation and long hours does to a guy.</STRONG>

Nothing personal <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

I could tell you two were starting to digress so I tried to put the thread back on target.

waku7
11-16-2001, 02:31 AM
Make games perdfect like the original is not the good thing to do.
The neo geo games are collector's item.
if you don't have the game you want, sorry for you but it's the life.
We don't always have all that we want.

It's like rich persons wanted a La Joconde perfe"dt copy for 100USD.

The fake cost nothing.

A real eruo magician lord is better than a fake perfect kizuna euro.


fake carts are shit

FTL
11-16-2001, 03:01 AM
Originally posted by waku7:
<STRONG>.

A real eruo magician lord is better than a fake perfect kizuna euro.


fake carts are shit</STRONG>

Mathieu,perrfect said.

Gary,assflounder,how can you say so?
Ok all will have cheap fake copies,but you CAN'T respect and value a REAL SNK rare game..you who have a great collection.
YOUR MS 1 US original is a really rare and beautiful videogame.
Trash your made fake manual and take a look at !arcade! MS 1 fake on ebay..they don't sell even for $300.

EVERY TIME HAS HIS OWN FORMS OF ART.
IN OUR TIMES, VIDEOGAMES ARE SURELY A FORM OF ART.

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 03:04 AM
You guys are getting so worked up over nothing, if you don't wanna buy fake carts, don't, the arcade versions will never replace the real thing, no ones fake versions will ever replace the real thing, period.

Moreover Arcade is hardly making enough of them to flood the scene with fake carts, he only got 35 orders for his AES 2, you think he's getting much more for his re-print AES carts?

Calm down, your overpriced scene is safe.

Hell, roms are out there, and their FREE, why is it Metal Slug still goes for a grand? When you could just download it like many do?

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Drift King EX ]

VinylBoy
11-16-2001, 04:16 AM
The whole concept of reproducing older and rare titles is so that GAMERS can get a chance to play these games. This whole scene gets more and more corrupt, thanks to those who let the whole idea of "collecting" go too far into their heads. For these people, only originals will do, however, to people who just want to have some extra games to have fun with, they will be all for it.

If Arcade can produce more games, then more power to him. The Neo scene should ALWAYS be about the game first, and not as a means for making one's personal finances. It would be great if people could make copies of games and get them to the public at a decent price. Regardless if they do or not, collectors will STILL be able to get their insane prices for their precious booty as long as they're good enough to find someone desperate and dumb enough to pay their prices. <IMG SRC="smilies/ohno.gif" border="0">

FTL
11-16-2001, 04:43 AM
Originally posted by VinylBoy:
<STRONG>The whole concept of reproducing older and rare titles is so that GAMERS can get a chance to play these games. This whole scene gets more and more corrupt, thanks to those who let the whole idea of "collecting" go too far into their heads. For these people, only originals will do, however, to people who just want to have some extra games to have fun with, they will be all for it.

If Arcade can produce more games, then more power to him. The Neo scene should ALWAYS be about the game first, and not as a means for making one's personal finances. It would be great if people could make copies of games and get them to the public at a decent price. Regardless if they do or not, collectors will STILL be able to get their insane prices for their precious booty as long as they're good enough to find someone desperate and dumb enough to pay their prices. <IMG SRC="smilies/ohno.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Vinyl boy,I remeber well you piad your Kizuna $350 or so,and now you got the almost the double of that..and it's totally right!
Kizuna encounter is a rare and beautiful game.
Gamers will have a cheap copy ok,but it has to be clear that it MUST be easy to spot the differnce between a copy and a fake...or what if your Kizuna was worth only $199 due to the copies around?
It's not a matter of money,it's a matter of Fairness.
Originals must remain the number they are.
People should realize that NGF is enough to bastardize the neogeo scene.

And at last and at least thet DO say that they are for neogeo not for SNK.
So they declare they make fake insert and it's even easier to know what you are buying.

But with a professional exact copy,the danger is real.

I seriously doubt that people like GA or others supporting fully !arcade! ideas are true collectors.
And home cart world is a collectors world.

A gamers has NO reason to want to own copies of rare home carts.
It would perfectly fit a home made different version JUST TO PLAY THE GAME.

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 04:56 AM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Vinyl boy,I remeber well you piad your Kizuna $350 or so,and now you got the almost the double of that..and it's totally right!
Kizuna encounter is a rare and beautiful game.
Gamers will have a cheap copy ok,but it has to be clear that it MUST be easy to spot the differnce between a copy and a fake...or what if your Kizuna was worth only $199 due to the copies around?
It's not a matter of money,it's a matter of Fairness.
Originals must remain the number they are.
People should realize that NGF is enough to bastardize the neogeo scene.

And at last and at least thet DO say that they are for neogeo not for SNK.
So they declare they make fake insert and it's even easier to know what you are buying.

But with a professional exact copy,the danger is real.

I seriously doubt that people like GA or others supporting fully !arcade! ideas are true collectors.
And home cart world is a collectors world.

A gamers has NO reason to want to own copies of rare home carts.
It would perfectly fit a home made different version JUST TO PLAY THE GAME.</STRONG>

Ok FTL, get over it, you don't wanna buy fake carts, we get it. The arcade re-releases are not gonna effect anything! So theres no use bitcing over it...

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Drift King EX ]

waku7
11-16-2001, 05:54 AM
I don't think ifd you don't have the same paper, the sames printing machines, you can make a perfect insert like real neo geo cart.
It can be very good quality, but with paper, sticker, and the MANUAL it's quasi impossible to do.
After play with converted kizuna euro is a good thing,if you are a player .
The converted cartridges of unreleased home cart was in the past a good mean to play neo geo games;
The converted cartridges of released home cart not interest me, because it's not really a rare item to collection.
But for a player/collector, it's a good way to play and to collect.

I hope nobody will never had the capacity to make converted carts like originals.

Fran
11-16-2001, 06:47 AM
Originally posted by rarehero:
<STRONG>good evening everyone,
i see alot of friends dropping the arguement
here so I'll try my best not to step on any
one's toes... I see both sides as very valid arguements first of all.
but i do have some pretty stong opinions about this though.
first i ll say that i am very much a gamer..
but i happen to be a collector too.
that doesnt mean i collect games to acrue value,
it means i collect games that i like.
i am very much against piracy, (this is not a reference towards conversions)
and i do not like the idea of having anthing that is not original in my collection
(that was in reference to conversions)
i love games and i pay alot for them.
im proud of my collection and even more proud
that everything i have is worth keeping
100 times over.
my NEOGEO games are quite possibly my favorites
though. maybe its a born bias of a strange
unexplainable love for a game company, but hey... its there isnt it? <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

!arcade! is an enigma to me.
but here you go.
they truely do the NEOGEO community a service.
they came out with converters which are from
what i hear, top notch and do the
wonderful feat of allowing you to play MVS games.
awsome.
they also did a great conversion no matter how
heavily critized of strikers 1945
they have done and helped many members around here
and i m sure many can atest to that.
like carlson said, !arcade!s quality of service is not being questioned here.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i really question releasing these rare carts
that are too similar to the originals.
im not speaking from the stand point of
a collector who wants MS1 to retain a 1000 dollar asking price
but from a NEOGEO customer that has to deal
with the origins of all carts now.
isnt it bad enough that we have to look for
stamps on our inserts now?
im not comparing NGFUSA to !arcade!
but i dont want to have to be weary of
close to original conversions all about.
i ve suggested this in a previous post
but !arcade! never responded to it. which of course wasnt neccessary.
it was a suggestion really.
why not make original art like the camo insert
MS1 as i said before the strikers 1945 insert
made by the fellas at !arcade! looks nice.
speaking of strikers why not just stick to unreleased carts?
if i was a person that had no thoughts about conversions
i would snatch up NitD in a heart beat. thats a great game
that otherwise would have never made it out to some people.
i truely dont really care about 1000 dollar carts but i do
know that if i ever go shoping for a twinkle star sprites which i think
is actually cool enough to almost be worth a couple hundred dollars.
then yes. i dont want to find out when i get the cart that its a
near original with a NEOGEOUSA.com url on it.
and me be in the very awkward position of trying to
fix the problem with the seller.
especially if im paying the price for it.
im an SNK purist.
i have to have the original. and im not going to pay anything for
something thats not SNK.
sorry if that sounds harsh but thats my childish point of view.
im not trying to keep the prices up..
i understand what !arcade! is trying to do.
and believe me its a noble cause.
but i have problems accepting that they will make high quality carts with art
that will be mistakened for the real thing.
the art if held next too each other can be distingushed but
otherwise would not be distinguishable to a newbie or someone
not knowledgeable about carts..
lets face it.

~not all people are honest.
and sellers may sell it intentionally in the future or unintentionally
to unsuspecting buyers.

~not all people are knowledgable about every facet of any subject.
thats why you see people asking why NGFUSA is supposed to be so
bad when dion and chris are a complete gentlemen to them.

!arcade!s done a good job of what they do.
but i think this is a bit contriversal
i dont know if its too much to ask !arcade! to look over these points
and try to answer them. after all, theyre on these boards more
often then their own im sure... <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

* change the inserts and cart art to something easily distingushiable from the original

* maybe stick to unreleased carts

reproducing the carts arent the problem
telling them apart from the real version imo is though.

all this reminds me of the korean SS4 carts.
some of these people had NEOGEO games for awhile
and been around for awhile too.
but all of a sudden everyone figured out there were problems
with the few that did not work properly.
...
h...
im trying to think if i left anything out..
if i think of more i ll let you guys know i guess <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">
thanks for listening though..
heh
this must be a record long post for me...

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: rarehero ]</STRONG>


simone is right

rarehero is right


i cant believe what some other people have written....dickheads


if you want cheap neo games go MVS

no need to moan about the price of an ORIGINAL aes metal slug...

what the fuck you care eh?

GO MVS !!!
buy the saturn - psx - whatever port !!

no one's forcing you,
we're not OBLIGING you to buy a slug 1 home cart for fucks sake

and then shut up


oh yeah,give us a cheap converted slug 1 for 300


dumb


as caris said,50 for the mvs

you're a gamer
ok

50 bucks and the mvs is yours

its not your business if me or simone want to have original SNK stuff and are ready to pay 200 - 300 - 400 - 500 for this or that

i only consider SNK original stuff

yeah

you can say im a stupid collector

go on and say that

see if i care


i am still the strongest kof player of this entire bbs


collector me arse


i am a gamer cos i play em,

A LOT

I AM A GAMER


and im a collector cos i want ORIGINAL snk home carts


i aint rich

i dont have a dc,dont have a psx2,dont have a gamecube

cos i save my money for my carts


i love em


and i play em

so please..


let me enjoy my hobby


dont moan at me cos i wanna pay 300 for magical drop

its none of your fuckin business


i am not raping a child or robbink a bank


i am using my OWN MONEY

that i EARNED


to buy ORIGINAL snk stuff

and people moan at me like if im WRONG?


fuck you !


fuck you

fuck you all


dicks

Fran
11-16-2001, 06:54 AM
....

and i dont hate arcade

talked to ray a few times


he was nice

and we talked about this issue,
a few weeks ago

told him exactly what simone said

i dont fuckin hate the man

i will buy a converter off him,one day


soon


or i might buy a CONVERTED shock troopers 1 cos i love that game

and dont want to buy a mvs converter for only one game


i know that troopers 1 will be a conversion

I KNOW IT IS

its alright

its my choice to buy it,
knowing its not snk made

and i will buy it


but as i said before,


arcade can reproduce carts if they want

they only gotta add something like a number or a small logo so that people know what they're buying

SIMPLE AS THAT

SIMPLE AS THAT


over


me computer is still dead


so i wont be able to reply

sorry guys

i miss you all

hope youre missin me too

* hugs *

OH YEAH


I RECEIVED MY SLUG 3 and its the best game EVER


<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

retrogame
11-16-2001, 06:58 AM
era un po che mi stavo chiedendo che fine avevi fatto... non ti vedo nemmeno su icq cosi mi sono ricordato che posti qui cosi'
volevo farti un salutino....
comunque vedo che porti avanti sempre le tue crociate per le tue idee :-) e guai a chi ti contraddice <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

volevo chiederti se metterai il naso sui server kaillera per fare 2 o 3 partitozze....

ciao.

PS
Il piu forte kof player del forum niente male allora .....si rumoreggiava che eri solo un kollezionista .......

retrociaooooo

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 07:37 AM
This issue is going nowhere fast.

Instead of bitching among ourselvs, why dont we wait and ask Ray what is going on with the reproductions. I have no idea what the prodcution entals, and it has not been disclosed (I think).

All this bitching could have been done in vain. I think he said something about chat on Sunday... Why dont we hold off the shit until we 100% know whats going on....

http://home.satx.rr.com/splurge/ntm.jpg

FTL
11-16-2001, 07:43 AM
That's really FUNNY NTM!!

Instead of telling the real status of the reproduction project,!arcade! keeps on hiding and being shady.

Arcade DOES read this thread,he even posted in,but heymway far from getting a CLEAR word.

FTL
11-16-2001, 07:46 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>This issue is going nowhere fast.


All this bitching could have been done in vain. I think he said something about chat on Sunday... Why dont we hold off the shit until we 100% know whats going on....

http://home.satx.rr.com/splurge/ntm.jpg </STRONG>

Yeah,can't quit laughing!
Chat...sunday..it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw.
You know it looks suspicious...

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 07:52 AM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>That's really FUNNY NTM!!

Instead of telling the real status of the reproduction project,!arcade! keeps on hiding and being shady.

Arcade DOES read this thread,he even posted in,but heymway far from getting a CLEAR word.</STRONG>

I dont see that as being shady really. What wrong with waiting to disclose information? Companies do that all the time. The only difference here, is that this company is active in the scene. And since that being the case, people expect them to be completely open and forthcoming with information at will. Even though they are active, they are still a company.


Yeah,can't quit laughing!
Chat...sunday..it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw.
You know it looks suspicious...

I dont know what to say to this, I never heard anything about it. This topic is starting to move from home cart reproductions to attacks against !Arcade!s credability.

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 07:58 AM
"it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw."

Not to worry, you will be seeing plently of them SOONER than you think!

Best Regards
!Arcade!

Robert
11-16-2001, 08:00 AM
The aim of many neo players is not to possess rare games but to possess good games.
In this point of view, buying reproducing games is not a real danger, if they're made like the real one's.

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 08:01 AM
"Instead of telling the real status of the reproduction project,!arcade! keeps on hiding and being shady."

A fine case of the "Pot calling the kettle black" one would think.

Best Regards
!Arcade!

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 08:06 AM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>"it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw."

Not to worry, you will be seeing plently of them SOONER than you think!

Best Regards
!Arcade!</STRONG>

Yea but they won't be real, am I right? Anyone can make homemade carts, no matter how good they are, I just don't see the big bragging aspect in that.

I'm sure I could buy Micky Mantle rookie card re-prints right now for a couple bucks each, but they still wouldn't be real.

If you've found some lost box full of actual Kizuna Euros, then thats a different story, but anyone trying to pass off re-prints as the real thing, would just be fraud, people do that in Sports Cards, and they ushaully go to jail.

FTL
11-16-2001, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>"it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw."

Not to worry, you will be seeing plently of them SOONER than you think!

Best Regards
!Arcade!</STRONG>

Who dares now to speak up for clearness of things?

Caris,!arcade! didn't discover nothing.
He will produce many U 11 Euro,WILL PRODUCE.

Anyone who think he found otherwise is totally wrong.

Well,what to say.
We are at the end of the story.
Who needs to wait until a chatrom meeting?
!aecade! will have "PLENTY" of U 11 euro and TSS jap,"PLENTY".

Bonus Kun,where are you now?
!arcade! is clearing every doubt about the reproduction matter,no problem.

FTL
11-16-2001, 08:25 AM
Originally posted by Drift King EX:
<STRONG>.

If you've found some lost box full of actual Kizuna Euros, then thats a different story, but anyone trying to pass off re-prints as the real thing, would just be fraud, people do that in Sports Cards, and they ushaully go to jail.</STRONG>

Wow Caris,it's easier to see a flying dog than !arcade! finding a lost box of Euro Kizuna.

Anyway,it seems the most of the people here care about having a cheap home made carts.

More!arcade! is NOT helping out making things clear but even it's trying to make things more shady.

As it was enough,EVEN on its own forum,replying to his followers like Shingo,only provides weird and unclear reply about reproduction matter.

It's NOT a personal attck towards !arcade! NEOTURFMASTA.
How could you be so blind not to see the !arcade! behaviour?

He posts here NOT to say.." I won't make fake carts to fool people,I will do it my way"..but only to make things more unclear.

But hey,!arcade! followers,you are served.

Sets
11-16-2001, 08:42 AM
well i'm late here but i've to say that i understand FTL when he says that reproduce rare game can be a danger.Not from !arcade!,because they 'll say 'this is a reproduce game" but by people who only see with that reproduce game a way to make easely money!
Look i collect some action figures of the serie "saint seiya" one of them is a really really rare piece and it cost 1000$ and more (no i don't have it <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> ) but some hong kong company sold the same piece but a reproduction of course,but a very good reproduction with the EXACTLY same box and lot of people bought them for a cheap price BUT sold them in france (and probably in all europe) as an "ORIGINAL" lot of people were cheated and abuse until the day people saw there are too many "original" action figure of these really rare piece after that nobody trust when someone try to sell these action figure coz there were so abuse they now trust no one
now you can find these fake for 100$/150$
so imagine a newbie come to find a rare cart as metal slug,tss or others and a vile people sell him a reproduce cart as an original fuck that! it's so simple to cheat people you know we can believe in an autoregulation of people cause some of them just live to do money and act like this coz for them"the end justifie the means"


hope some of you ll understand why i mean
I'm a player but i'm a collector too (and i'm not multimillionaire!)

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Sets ]

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 09:23 AM
"More!arcade! is NOT helping out making things clear but even it's trying to make things more shady."

Let's try to clear up a few issues here and I am going to address these issues from a personal perspective and not a company one.

I have 21,000 original SNK blank roms and 7,500 original SNK PCB's (boards), had them for some time now. I also have a set of original SNK templates and the SNK source code book. Now let's think of it this way shall we, if I was going to re-produce the *Rare* titles and pass them off as real why would I go through all the trouble of producing my own PCB's (boards). We are going to be using the SNK parts for 2 projects of our own that we are working on.

I can fully understand the collectors point of view not wanting to see their collections de-valued by someone flooding the market with EXACT re-productions. Make no mistake about it if I did this they would be exact and even SNK would not be able to tell the difference. That being said why would I say I was thinking of doing this? Simple really it's what I like to call "Shaking the trees" to see what falls out, a few of you know exactly what I am talking about.

Most of the so called "High-end" guys already know that there are 2 conversion guys in your group. I un-like some of you will not make an un-founded accusation but I do have my doubts about a couple of carts already on the market. The other thing I will let out before Sundays chat is that Nikke is my partner, has been for some time now.

The reason(s) he and I have have for him withdrawing from the North American market are quite simple really. Some of you have been ripping him off and 2 of you for thousands of dollars, this will all be expained on Sunday. !Arcade! as well has been "Clipped" a few times by a couple of people as well, you know who you are.

Back to the re-productions, all of you who have dealt with me know that I have been fair and honest in our dealings. I have sold many of the so-called *Rare* titles to you at more than fair prices only to see or hear that some of you the very next day have re-sold them at double what I sold them to you for. That's all well and good, business I guess not good business but business just the same. There are 3 of you that have been e-mailing me offering outrageous amounts for carts, you should now by now that I will never do business with you again-period.

When and if we do these re-productions keep this in mind they will be re-productions and will be marked as such. The appropriate parties will have been fully compensated if need be and we will have permission to do them. It's not hard to get really all you have to do is ask most of the time and they are happy to give it to you-free.

In closing let me say this to the 2 conversion guys out there, I am going to get you and when I do I will show everyone what *Nice* people you really are. No, it's not the 2 over at ***.

I am sure that there will be a lot more questions which can certainly be asked and answered in Sundays chat.

Best Regards
Ray Young

Blaine
11-16-2001, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>When and if we do these re-productions keep this in mind they will be re-productions and will be marked as such. The appropriate parties will have been fully compensated if need be and we will have permission to do them. It's not hard to get really all you have to do is ask most of the time and they are happy to give it to you-free.</STRONG>

This is very true. From my experience I've found that the creator/owners of older copyrighted work will be more than happy to let you use their work, sometimes for little or no compensation. I could only imagine this would be doubly so for say...artwork that was made for a game manual and really is of little use as anything else.

I'm sure you'd pay out your ass to get the rights to reproduce a Lords Of Thunder manual though (Masamune Shirow of Ghost In The Shell fame did it and whatever he touches instantly becomes gold).

But I'd be willing to bet that the current legal owners wouldn't care that much.

I could be wrong, but that's just my take on it.

*edited because I put Amano instead of Shirow*

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Blaine ]

Neo Rasa
11-16-2001, 10:40 AM
The reason(s) he and I have have for him withdrawing from the North American market are quite simple really. Some of you have been ripping him off and 2 of you for thousands of dollars, this will all be expained on Sunday. !Arcade! as well has been "Clipped" a few times by a couple of people as well, you know who you are.

Back to the re-productions, all of you who have dealt with me know that I have been fair and honest in our dealings. I have sold many of the so-called *Rare* titles to you at more than fair prices only to see or hear that some of you the very next day have re-sold them at double what I sold them to you for. That's all well and good, business I guess not good business but business just the same. There are 3 of you that have been e-mailing me offering outrageous amounts for carts, you should now by now that I will never do business with you again-period.

When and if we do these re-productions keep this in mind they will be re-productions and will be marked as such. The appropriate parties will have been fully compensated if need be and we will have permission to do them. It's not hard to get really all you have to do is ask most of the time and they are happy to give it to you-free.

In closing let me say this to the 2 conversion guys out there, I am going to get you and when I do I will show everyone what *Nice* people you really are. No, it's not the 2 over at ***.

The bomb drops...again...

FTL
11-16-2001, 10:43 AM
None NEVER doubted your honesty Ray.
The whole thread was intended to the danger of a remarket opweration of perfect copy and so possible scams.

You pointed out very well your position.
But again,this was not a personal attack in anyway.

I was only waiting for you to clear up things.

What is wrong offering much money to get a rare home cart?
It has a real value if it's rare and collectible item.

Again,in our time,videogames are a for of ART.

Anyway,I feel how sad is tyour selling cheap to persons who resold for the double then.

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>None NEVER doubted your honesty Ray.
</STRONG>

For some reason, maybe I am mistaken, but you have implied a few times about !Arcade! being shady. To me, that sounds like you are doubting their honesty. Am I wrong?

NeoDragoN
11-16-2001, 10:56 AM
If !arcade! Does Reproduce Carts of the Rare Games would'nt the Prices Drop?? If So is'nt this what everyone wants? most of u are always moaning about high prices.

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 10:59 AM
Originally posted by NeoDragoN:
<STRONG>If !arcade! Does Reproduce Carts of the Rare Games would'nt the Prices Drop?? If So is'nt this what everyone wants? most of u are always moaning about high prices.</STRONG>

Yeah, all sane Neo gamers/collectors want that. But if the price drops, wont peoples status and collection prices be in jepordy?

hmmmm......

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 11:00 AM
"None NEVER doubted your honesty Ray."

That is not true and we both know it, we both know how the game is played.

"But again,this was not a personal attack in anyway."

It was never taken that way.

"I was only waiting for you to clear up things."

I hope I have done that and this matter may be laid to rest. But be assured of one thing there are a few more issues yet to be cleared up.

"What is wrong offering much money to get a rare home cart?
It has a real value if it's rare and collectible item."

Never said there was anything wrong with it. What I said was why offer outrageous amounts for a cart you know can be found much cheaper.

FTL
11-16-2001, 11:01 AM
NTM,I used shady to mean UNCLEAR,not dishonest.

My concern was about the aftermarked.

I'm a colector and some time I got burned with fake carts,losing my money.

That's all.

rarehero
11-16-2001, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>
Best Regards
Ray Young</STRONG>

thanks for the reply,
i suppose i will see
everyone in chat on sunday.

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 11:07 AM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>NTM,I used shady to mean UNCLEAR,not dishonest.
</STRONG>

OK, my mistake. What do you mean by suspicious? Maybe its me, but that bottom quote all but says you dont trust !Arcade!'s honesty.


Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Yeah,can't quit laughing!
Chat...sunday..it remeinds me about the -say 3-copies of Ultimate 11 Euro he had in stock and NONE never saw.
You know it looks suspicious...</STRONG>

But I wont push this subject any further. Beating a dead horse as far as I'm concerned.


edit: replaced credibility with honesty.

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: NeoTurfMasta ]

FTL
11-16-2001, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>"None NEVER doubted your honesty Ray."

That is not true and we both know it, we both know how the game is played.

"But again,this was not a personal attack in anyway."

It was never taken that way.
</STRONG>

Sorry Ray but you are wrong.
You was fair in our transaction time ago,but I really spent much time searching for carts for my collection.
I know how rare some titles are.

I was a skeptical but never said you sold fake home carts as real.

You know well how long I'm searching rare carts.
And having persons-DISHONEST PERSONS this time-reselling it as a real thing is really a thing is not useful.

Please remeber that the complain was about aftermarket sales not about your first sale of your reproduction.

So I don't see the point.
Never was questioned your honesty,but yes was questioned your new businnes and its development.

FTL
11-16-2001, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by NeoTurfMasta:
<STRONG>But I wont push this subject any further. Beating a dead horse as far as I'm concerned.


edit: replaced credibility with honesty.

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: NeoTurfMasta ]</STRONG>

Sorry NTM,but you are NOT enough expert in the neogeo market.
Having 3 U 11 is really AMAZING.
you can't realize how RARE is Ultimate 11.

So YES,it was for me suspicious,but not to say that they were fake.
Only really would have liked to have a chance to buy one and nor I,nor none of my friend collectors managed to get a copy.

It seems they were sold to more lucky collectors.

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: FTL ]

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 11:19 AM
"And having persons-DISHONEST PERSONS this time-reselling it as a real thing is really a thing is not useful"

My point exactly, and Nikke will bring you up to speed on a couple of them Sunday.

As far as I am concerned this matter is closed. If I or my company has offended anyone you have my apology, now let's move on shall we.

Anyone hear that KOF 2001, is going to be delayed until next year. Seeems they are having problems with the code.

We have a Beta copy and it seems to have been rushed a bit.

Best Regards
Ray Young

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Sorry NTM,but you are NOT enough expert in the neogeo market.
</STRONG>

Yeah, I guess your probably right. My ignorance and stupidity have once again reared its ugly head. I tip my hat to you. I am not worthy to speak to a expert in the neo market, like yourself. Nor am I worthy to speak to a expert collector, like yourself... I will try to think before I open my, NeoIgnorant mouth.

I apologize. I shall change my name to NeoTardMaster.

edit: added word

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: NeoTurfMasta ]

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 12:15 PM
I would like to ask this to Ray, without any flames...
Do you really think that there's a market for these 'reproducted' carts of yours?
Do you really think that there's people in line waiting to spend $300/400 for a reproduced OverTop, Ninja Master's or Kizuna Encounter?
I mean, these carts won't certainly appeal to serious collectors, who want exclusively original stuff; but they won't appeal to the casual/normal gamers as well, cause they can play these games for cheap (NOT $300/400) on MVS format...
These rare carts are desired only by collectors... and they won't definitely buy a reproduction!!
So to me there's actually no market for these, and therefore no reason for the whole reproduction thing...
I really would like to hear from you...

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 12:19 PM
"I really would like to hear from you"

Take the time to Re-read my posts.

Best Regards
!Arcade!

chainsawyak
11-16-2001, 12:23 PM
Where's this chat on Sunday? Does Arcade have a chat room on their site, or is it gonna be here? What time is it going to be held? I look forward to it, I'm sure we're going to find out some interesting stuff... <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

rarehero
11-16-2001, 12:39 PM
yea.
irc channel #!arcade!
nikkes gonna be there.

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 01:02 PM
By the way, i really don't like quotes like
"it's time to unload your precious collection" or "you will be seeing plenty of them sooner than you think"...
Are you tryin' to threaten us collectors?
It seems to me that you're really enjoying your current position of possibly ruining the Neo scene as we know it, with this reproduction thing...
Be careful though, you could end up breakin' your little toy with your own hands... <IMG SRC="smilies/smirk.gif" border="0">

VinylBoy
11-16-2001, 01:05 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
Vinyl boy,I remeber well you piad your Kizuna $350 or so,and now you got the almost the double of that..and it's totally right!

The only reason why I got that amount is because someone offered it to me. I never ONCE placed a price tag on the item. If you recall, when I placed Kizuna Encounter on the market I told people to place their offers. I would have sold the game for cheaper... but I'm not going to if someone offers me more. There'a a MAJOR difference if someone offers a high amount for a game instead of just demanding it from the start. Don't get these things mixed up...


Kizuna encounter is a rare and beautiful game.
Gamers will have a cheap copy ok,but it has to be clear that it MUST be easy to spot the differnce between a copy and a fake...or what if your Kizuna was worth only $199 due to the copies around?
It's not a matter of money,it's a matter of Fairness.

OK... take into consideration the converted home cart I have of Waku Waku 7. Even though I have a converted cart (which is not an official home release version), the price of an official Waku Waku 7 cart (US or Japanese or whatever) HASN'T dropped. Making a reproduction run of games allow gamers like us to get these games. And as long as it's noted that these are "reproduced" copies everything will be fine. Collectors like yourself can still continue your pursuits for the "original" ones and can still demand your high prices for them.


Originals must remain the number they are.
People should realize that NGF is enough to bastardize the neogeo scene.

There will always be bad apples in the bunch. However, not everyone that makes "converted" carts try to pass them off as authentic. People who do things like this should always be exposed for their faults. However, if someone willingly wants to place a reproduced copy on the market AND do it the right way, they should have that right wthout any ridicule.


I seriously doubt that people like GA or others supporting fully !arcade! ideas are true collectors.
And home cart world is a collectors world.

Whatever... whether it be home carts, CDs, MVS or whatever format you decide to buy your games, GAMERS WILL ALWAYS COME FIRST. There are more of them than more of you... The whole fear of making "reproduced" carts sit in your minds, since more people would do a more sensible thing by settling for a copy. These copies will NEVER bring down the price of an original since collectors will NEVER allow that to happen. You'll still demand your $1000+ for a Metal Slug Home Cart... it just may be more difficult for you to find a customer since people who want to PLAY the game may settle for another means of getting it, without necessarily spending too much.


A gamers has NO reason to want to own copies of rare home carts.
It would perfectly fit a home made different version JUST TO PLAY THE GAME.

So basically... since fighting games are one of my favorite genres of all time and I'm a gamer, I shouldn't have bought the Kizuna Encounter cart when it was offered to me years ago at a reasonable price... I should just ignore games that intrigue me like NinjaMasters and Breakers if they are also offered to me at prices I would consider. DO YOU REALIZE HOW STUPID THAT SOUNDS???!? How dare you tell me what I shouldn't be interested in or curious about, simply because I'm a gamer and not a collector???!? <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0">

I want these rare games BECAUSE I WANT TO PLAY THEM. And if I can find them at a price that is within my budget, I WILL PURCHASE THEM. And if I decide to sell them later on, if someone offers to pay me even quadruple what I initialy paid for I will accept it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, so stop freaking out about your precious collection... it will STILL maintain its value regardless of how many "knock off" games are released. <IMG SRC="smilies/ohno.gif" border="0">

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: VinylBoy ]

Robert
11-16-2001, 01:06 PM
It's a huge problem because every neo gamers want to have the latest neo new games for a cheaper price and in the other hand the success of the neo cart is based on the fact that SNK produce few great games (just the nimber of copies of the last releases).

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 01:07 PM
Originally posted by Bobak:
<STRONG>Does it need to be totally different?</STRONG>

At least that would definitely eliminate the aftermarket problem... (when reselling these items)

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 01:09 PM
"By the way, i really don't like quotes"

By the way, I don't give a damn what you like.

"Are you tryin' to threaten us collectors"

Are you trying to threaten us gamers.

"Be careful though, you could end up breakin' your little toy with your own hands"

I will leave that up to the girlfriend, thank you very much!

Back to ICQ now to think up your reply with your "Buds"

Best regards

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>"I really would like to hear from you"

Take the time to Re-read my posts.

Best Regards
!Arcade!</STRONG>

I did it, but i still have to read the post, in which you explain why you feel the urge to do such thing, apart the fact that you have a stock of ROMs and PCBs to get rid of... and you want to make money, of course...

VinylBoy
11-16-2001, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by robert:
<STRONG>It's a huge problem because every neo gamers want to have the latest neo new games for a cheaper price and in the other hand the success of the neo cart is based on the fact that SNK produce few great games (just the nimber of copies of the last releases).</STRONG>

You're not looking at it from every angle...

If someone wants to get an "original" they have to pay the price.

If someone wants to get a "copy" they can, but that copy will not knock down the price of the original version. It's like saying the Mona Lisa would cost less if someone ran off a 1000 copies of the picture and sold them.

The two items are the same, yet VERY different. It just makes it more difficult for the "collector" to make his money because the addition of duplicate carts will make it easier for gamers to get their money, instead of surrendering to the collector's higher price. An original cart will ALWAYS cost more than a copy because a collector will NEVER allow the prices to be even... and if someone wants a game at a cheaper price just so that they can play it, they should be able to settle for the copy.

This has NOTHING to do with the value of the carts... but it has EVERYTHING to do with providing options for those who want to play games. Why are people willing to take that privilege away from others just so that you can "protect your investment"?

BRANDI
11-16-2001, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>Back to ICQ now to think up your reply with your "Buds"</STRONG>

We're different, Ray...
I have friends like Simone, Fran and many other collectors, while you have sidekicks like Drunken, GamerAbyss... <IMG SRC="smilies/smirk.gif" border="0">

Metal Slug
11-16-2001, 01:23 PM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>"When and if we do these re-productions keep this in mind they will be re-productions and will be marked as such. The appropriate parties will have been fully compensated if need be and we will have permission to do them. It's not hard to get really all you have to do is ask most of the time and they are happy to give it to you-free.

Best Regards
Ray Young</STRONG>


OK, I've been quick enough to criticise in the past! So I should be quick to voice my approval!
I'm greatly relieved to see your comments above, I wont comment on the other issues you mention, as I have no knowedge of them. But I would support any company that made these "reproductions" after having sought permission from the current licence holders, paid whatever fees etc.

I have said before that your company often falls down because of a lack of direct comment on upcoming projects, to the eager and news hungry, NEO community!
I'm pleased to see that in this case that is not the case.

Well done !ARCADE!

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 01:24 PM
"We're different, Ray...
I have friends like Simone, Fran and many other collectors, while you have sidekicks like Drunken, GamerAbyss"

I am very happy for you and your "friends"
I am done here so I won't be replying to you or your "friends" again.

You are far and away the superior person, I know when I am beaten.

Best Regards

FeelGood
11-16-2001, 01:27 PM
I like the allusion to the Saint Seiya action figure - maybe not !arcade! but some reseller will find a shmuck to buy the cart as a real authentic NGH, and although the game will play sweet and look mint, he'll have to get rid of it because it's not what he wanted.

So let's take Ray out of the equation and stress the need for distinction between his new carts and the old ones.

Personally though, I see a bunch of MVS only titles that I'd like to see on NGH first, like Captain Tomaday. Why move to "rare" carts when we still don't have all the games on NGH? At least Captain Tomaday. I'm sure that it's in the works for !arcade!, but I'd rather see productions before reproductions.

Robert
11-16-2001, 01:36 PM
I understand all the fans who don't want these reproductions.
But can you give a solution to play to Garou if I didn't have 450$?
Don't ask me the MVS because it's more hard to find in france that the AES version

FTL
11-16-2001, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by VinylBoy:
<STRONG>So basically... since fighting games are one of my favorite genres of all time and I'm a gamer, I shouldn't have bought the Kizuna Encounter cart when it was offered to me years ago at a reasonable price... I should just ignore games that intrigue me like NinjaMasters and Breakers if they are also offered to me at prices I would consider. DO YOU REALIZE HOW STUPID THAT SOUNDS???!? How dare you tell me what I shouldn't be interested in or curious about, simply because I'm a gamer and not a collector???!? <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0">

I want these rare games BECAUSE I WANT TO PLAY THEM. And if I can find them at a price that is within my budget, I WILL PURCHASE THEM. And if I decide to sell them later on, if someone offers to pay me even quadruple what I initialy paid for I will accept it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, so stop freaking out about your precious collection... it will STILL maintain its value regardless of how many "knock off" games are released. <IMG SRC="smilies/ohno.gif" border="0">

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: VinylBoy ]</STRONG>

Calm down Vinyl boy.
You misunderstood my words.
A PURE gamer will pass on high priced home carts and get mvs or home made instead.
BUT a gamer can of course spend big money to get an home cart since he loves it.

But it was a general speaking nothint direct to say a gamer can't buy what he likes.
Com'on Vinylboy,let's communicate a bit further...

As for NTM,your sarcasm is out of need.
Ray Young doesn't need another bodyguard.


And yes,maybe some people shpuld learn a bit more about home carts rarity before bitching about prices .

Metal Slug
11-16-2001, 01:51 PM
Originally posted by robert:
<STRONG>I understand all the fans who don't want these reproductions.
But can you give a solution to play to Garou if I didn't have 450$?
Don't ask me the MVS because it's more hard to find in france that the AES version</STRONG>

I think the difference between an un-authorised repro, and an "officially" sanctioned re-print, is an improtant one.
As long as !ARCADE! does seek permission etc, this will just be a continuation of the NEO name! (I HOPE <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">)

Fran
11-16-2001, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
[QB
Back to ICQ now to think up your reply with your "Buds"

Best regards[/QB]

fuckin hell

brandi aint on icq


........


that aside


its not like....


some people have a mind of their own,Ray


they dont need to be told what to say

im sure you know what i mean

alright


i didnt know about that

"ei you dickheads collectors get ready to sell your shit" line

sounds like fun


come on ray


no need to be THAT hard all the time


love is the best strenght

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>
As for NTM,your sarcasm is out of need.
Ray Young doesn't need another bodyguard.
</STRONG>

I'm just trying to brighten up your day a little. Sarcasm can be fun you know...

Anyways, maybe this is another misunderstanding between us, but I am not a bodyguard for anyone. If anyone needs one, its me.

I'm very fragile you know... <IMG SRC="smilies/crying.gif" border="0">

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 02:04 PM
You know some of !Arcades! lines sound very Dion-ish, "Better sell your SNK shit now, cause "Our" versions are coming out". Seems like very elitist comments.

You'd think you'd want to "make" customers, not "Alientate" them. I mean no wonder he only got 30 something pre-orders for the AES II. Dion could have got more than 30, "Goofi" would have probably bought a few.

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: Drift King EX ]

GamersAbyss
11-16-2001, 02:06 PM
Brandi what are you talking about now? I hear a bunch of the fuckers on this thread have been making rips of their own!!!

Yeah thats right you bunch of bootleging bitches!!! Your asses will be found out soon enough!!! You know what is funny you bring my name up like I am Neo scum!! You crack me up you home cart collecting Dork!! My collection of Video Games in general kicks the shit out of yours and anone who has seen it can atest to that!!

Big Bruno is another guy who has a massive collection!! You dont see him looking down on people now do you? The fact is if you took both my businesses and my collection I could buy you and every fuck on your mailing list so think about that the next time you look down your nose at me ya piece of shit!!

And NTM dont waste your breath on these Elitest fucks, they only wish they had the true friends that you do!! You assholes make me sick!! Oh and for anyone who doubts what I say I will have pics on my webpage soon!!

Fran
11-16-2001, 02:08 PM
lol goofy

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 02:10 PM
Didn't Dion sell a KOF 2000 cart to like Osama Bin Ladens Cousin or something? I remember him having some scanned payment document from a King or Shiek from some Arab Country.

NeoTurfMasta
11-16-2001, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by GamersAbyss:
[QB]

And NTM dont waste your breath on these Elitest fucks, they only wish they had the true friends that you do!! [QB]

But I oh so want FTL's approval. If I reply to him enough times, maybe I too can be cool and accepted. Alas, I think my day will never come. I only play Super Nintendo ports of Neo Geo games.. I am so very poor.

Disclaimer: To avoid any future misunderstandings, this was indeed sarcasm. Ment as a joke, not intened to offend, insult, or enrage anyone. The author take no responsibility for readers actions.

neobuyer
11-16-2001, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by Fran:
<STRONG>
so please..


let me enjoy my hobby


dont moan at me cos i wanna pay 300 for magical drop

its none of your fuckin business


i am not raping a child or robbink a bank


i am using my OWN MONEY

that i EARNED


to buy ORIGINAL snk stuff

and people moan at me like if im WRONG?


fuck you !


fuck you

fuck you all


dicks</STRONG>

Hahahahahah!!!

File this one under "Best posts ever".

*LOL* X1000

simon
11-16-2001, 03:12 PM
Originally posted by !Arcade!:
<STRONG>
Anyone hear that KOF 2001, is going to be delayed until next year. Seeems they are having problems with the code.

We have a Beta copy and it seems to have been rushed a bit.

Best Regards
Ray Young</STRONG>

??
The MVS kit is sold by Japanese and HK arcade wholesalers since the begining of the week already.

!Arcade!
11-16-2001, 03:31 PM
"??
The MVS kit is sold by Japanese and HK arcade wholesalers since the begining of the week already."

"Apple Industries (SNK's sales and marketing rep in the U.S.) tells RePlay that the Eolith- licensed King of Fighters 2001, being developed by that Korean firm for SNK, will make it's way to the U.S. by early next year. " http://www.replaymagazine.com/hotpress.htm

Changes are being made.

Regards

chimpmeister
11-16-2001, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by GamersAbyss:
<STRONG>&lt;snip&gt; Oh and for anyone who doubts what I say I will have pics on my webpage soon!!</STRONG>

Would that be on your webpage which you reference at the bottom of every post you make, where it says "Click Here : Looking for Arcade, Home System or Pinballs? You found the place!!!"???

Because for the life of me, I can never find anywhere to click . . . <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

Viewpoint
11-16-2001, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Sorry NTM,but you are NOT enough expert in the neogeo market.</STRONG>

And what Pray tell makes you or any of us such experts?

Did you work for SNK did you ACTUALLY see the actual print runs for each & every SNK AES cart ever made?

If not, Then THAT is a very high claim. I don't think hardly ANYONE expect the guys who actually worked at SNK at one point or another who actually were involved with the AES should be considered experts.

The rest of anyone else is just making guesses on this part of the Neo Scene considering there are many other parts out there that not even the 'Experts' are aware of I'm sure.

God www.Neo-EGO.com/ (http://www.Neo-EGO.com/) Strikes again...

Fran
11-16-2001, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by neobuyer:
<STRONG>Hahahahahah!!!

File this one under "Best posts ever".

*LOL* X1000</STRONG>

i like this line better,scott

"..see if i care
i am still the strongest kof player of this entire bbs.."

im full of shit,man


heh

NeoDragoN
11-16-2001, 03:44 PM
You Know the answer!! MVS ALL THE WAY!!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0">

Fran
11-16-2001, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by NeoDragoN:
<STRONG>You Know the answer!! MVS ALL THE WAY!!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

no way man

mvs is for poor digs who cant afford shit

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yes,i was being ironic and all that

so dont moan at me

FTL
11-16-2001, 04:24 PM
Bonuskun:
expert is who is into neo for more than 10 years and collecting for the same time.

So,yes,it's impossible to know all,but hey Kant really told us something important:

WITHIN our limits we can be expert and sure we are 100% correct.

Better 100 times that an agnosticism .

Viewpoint
11-16-2001, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Bonuskun:
expert is who is into neo for more than 10 years and collecting for the same time.

So,yes,it's impossible to know all,but hey Kant really told us something important:

WITHIN our limits we can be expert and sure we are 100% correct.

Better 100 times that an agnosticism .</STRONG>

So what 10 years?

I'm an expert on making a bowl of cereal but you don't see me belittling other people with such an ego that I have to REMIND others of my expertise.

I don't approve of such arrogance in any form, place or hobby out there. It just comes off and being a self-centered jerk.

Do talk about you being an expert.

Show it or put a sock in it.

Oh and I've been into Videogaming as a whole SINCE 1978 but I don't see the need to call myself an EXPERT. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: BonusKun ]

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
<STRONG>Bonuskun:
expert is who is into neo for more than 10 years and collecting for the same time.

So,yes,it's impossible to know all,but hey Kant really told us something important:

WITHIN our limits we can be expert and sure we are 100% correct.

Better 100 times that an agnosticism .</STRONG>

I don't understand a damn word anyone from Italy says... even when they speak in english.

NeoDragoN
11-16-2001, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by Fran:
<STRONG>no way man

mvs is for poor digs who cant afford shit

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yes,i was being ironic and all that

so dont moan at me</STRONG>

yeah but my kizuna cost me 30 bucksand i don't care if someone reproduces what have i got to loose <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

aria
11-16-2001, 04:44 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>And what Pray tell makes you or any of us such experts?
</STRONG>

Well, I am an Expert and you are all idiots <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smirk.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue.gif" border="0">

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by Bobak:
<STRONG>Well, I am an Expert and you are all idiots <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smirk.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Yes but I taught you everything you know, so I am the true expert.

chimpmeister
11-16-2001, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>So what 10 years?

I'm an expert on making a bowl of cereal but you don't see me belittling other people with such an ego that I have to REMIND others of my expertise.

I don't approve of such arrogance in any form, place or hobby out there. It just comes off and being a self-centered jerk.

Do talk about you being an expert.

Show it or put a sock in it.

Oh and I've been into Videogaming as a whole SINCE 1978 but I don't see the need to call myself an EXPERT. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: BonusKun ]</STRONG>

So young, and yet so bitter . . . <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0">

FTL
11-16-2001, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by BonusKun:
<STRONG>So what 10 years?

I'm an expert on making a bowl of cereal but you don't see me belittling other people with such an ego that I have to REMIND others of my expertise.

I don't approve of such arrogance in any form, place or hobby out there. It just comes off and being a self-centered jerk.

Do talk about you being an expert.

Show it or put a sock in it.

Oh and I've been into Videogaming as a whole SINCE 1978 but I don't see the need to call myself an EXPERT. <IMG SRC="smilies/rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: BonusKun ]</STRONG>
Let's put the thing so.

Hunting down for rare carts for 10 years makes me quite sure of what is rare and what is not.
I'm NOT showing off anything.
I was just explaing while I was skeptical about !arcade! having 3 U 11 euro.

I put attention and passion in my neogeo hobbie that's all.
Clearly who is nort a neogeo collector can't get what I mean.

Bonuskun,if you are into vg from 1978,more power to you.
But still,I know the neogeo home carts well.

Caris Nautilus
11-16-2001, 04:49 PM
Originally posted by chimpmeister:
<STRONG>So young, and yet so bitter . . . <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0"></STRONG>

Yea he's young, whats your excuse? <IMG SRC="smilies/tickled.gif" border="0">

And I thought you were supposed to get wiser with age...

GamersAbyss
11-16-2001, 05:09 PM
Here you go Chimp you bone smokin fag!!!!! My signature is fixed how do you like the address?

neobuyer
11-16-2001, 05:16 PM
Originally posted by Fran:
<STRONG>i like this line better,scott

"..see if i care
i am still the strongest kof player of this entire bbs.."

im full of shit,man


heh</STRONG>

I like that one too... <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

chimpmeister
11-16-2001, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by GamersAbyss:
<STRONG>Here you go Chimp you bone smokin fag!!!!! My signature is fixed how do you like the address?</STRONG>

Thanks, good job on that!!

However, no need to be so edgy, was just a simple request . . . <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

Viewpoint
11-16-2001, 05:27 PM
Originally posted by FTL:
Let's put the thing so.

Hunting down for rare carts for 10 years makes me quite sure of what is rare and what is not.
I'm NOT showing off anything.
I was just explaing while I was skeptical about !arcade! having 3 U 11 euro.

I put attention and passion in my neogeo hobbie that's all.
Clearly who is nort a neogeo collector can't get what I mean.

Bonuskun,if you are into vg from 1978,more power to you.
But still,I know the neogeo home carts well.[/QB]

If you know the Neo Geo home carts that's fine and dandy but it helps to get your point across if you DON'T brag about it.

Nobody wants to listen to an ego filled statement so think about that for a second ok?

[ November 16, 2001: Message edited by: BonusKun ]

GamersAbyss
11-16-2001, 06:05 PM
When FTL and Brandi and the rest of these wanna-be's get past my 21 years of experience in the Video Game/Arcade market then they will have something to brag about, until then they can keep sniffing thier minty fresh baggies...LMAO!!

It makes you an expert to be in the Neo scene for 10 years? Hmmmmmm well since I bought one on US release date OVER 10 years ago I guess I will change my name to "ExpertAbyss"

FTL
11-16-2001, 06:37 PM
Bonuskun you are right.
But again,I wasn't bragging at all.
I was only giving REASON why I was suspicious about U 11 and so supporting my statements since being accused by another member.

End of the story,at least from my side.
WE will see what happens.

GamersAbyss
11-16-2001, 07:54 PM
Oh, how easily they are punked out when they are made to look like idiots!!!! FTL, I dont know how you can have 10 years of experience chasing down rare Neo carts when for the first five years of the systems life you hardly had to chase any title down.

All you had to do is pick up the phone with 300 bucks on your credit card and Japan video games or Frank at the Realm Entertainment (one of the only official US neo distributors at the time) could send you out your cart, any cart, right on the spot!!

So I guess at most you have been hunting for 5 years, either that or you didnt know where to look!!! Some "Expert"

Pichai
11-16-2001, 08:19 PM
I have 20+ years of Video games. Some of you weren't even born when I was riding my bike up and down the main road with my buddies looking for bottles to redeem for 5 cent. When we have accumulated 2 dollars (seem like alot back then) we head for the nearest arcade and play games like Sea Wolf, Atari Football, Dog Patch, and Night Driver. Games that most of you only see on Emulators. I stopped spending money at the arcade in 1981 when I saw the Vic-20 (love at first sight). That blazing 1.01 MHZ speed and all 3K RAM. But, my real true love was the Amiga, even to this date I still love it over PC.

-Pichai

Blaine
11-16-2001, 08:24 PM
A Mathematician, A Physicist and A Chemist are riding in a train in Scotland.

They see a black sheep.

The Chemist says "Look. Scottish Sheep Are Black."

The Physicist says "No, no. Some Scottish Sheep Are Black."

The Mathematician pauses, looks up and says "In Scotland, there is at least one field where there lives at least one sheep who is black on at least one side."

GamersAbyss
11-16-2001, 10:09 PM
Yeah the good ole days huh Pichai? It amazes me how some of these kids call themselves experts when they werent even alive at the dawn of the Video Game era. Pichai come to chat sometime at #neo-geo, I am sure it would be a great chat!!

TonK
11-16-2001, 11:21 PM
If Ray made an "EXACT" 100% "EXACT" re-production of Japanese Slug 1 put my ass in line for one...

Using SNK's boards and ROMs...

Damn, its like SNK made the fucking thing...

Ray, I hope you polish off the high prices!

Fuck the collectors...

Play the motherfucking game, don't look at it....

Slug 1 happens to be my fav game and I can't own it cause some motherfucker is looking at itcon his shelf and getting a hard-on...

I could have my original and be happy...

but no... some SHADY collector has it.

Ray, kill the prices!

And who ripped you and Nikke?

16-bit
11-17-2001, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by Drift King EX:
<STRONG>I don't understand a damn word anyone from Italy says... even when they speak in english.</STRONG>

Well...

Expand your horizon: learn Italian.

Carlson

Robert
11-17-2001, 12:36 AM
Why don't make a poll on this topic?

assflounder
11-17-2001, 01:21 AM
At over 170 posts now , are you all starting to get the jist? If you have not figured it out by now ,I will explain it to you. Its all about control.....who has it....who wants it.....and who can afford it.

BRANDI
11-17-2001, 02:00 AM
Originally posted by GamersAbyss:
<STRONG>Oh, how easily they are punked out when they are made to look like idiots!!!! FTL, I dont know how you can have 10 years of experience chasing down rare Neo carts when for the first five years of the systems life you hardly had to chase any title down.

All you had to do is pick up the phone with 300 bucks on your credit card and Japan video games or Frank at the Realm Entertainment (one of the only official US neo distributors at the time) could send you out your cart, any cart, right on the spot!!

So I guess at most you have been hunting for 5 years, either that or you didnt know where to look!!! Some "Expert"</STRONG>

If you knew Simone (FTL), his passion and his knowledge of the Neo scene, you wouldn't talk like that... <IMG SRC="smilies/cool.gif" border="0">
By the way i'm 29 and he's 26, so we're not exactly videogames newbies... personally i began playing with the first pong machines...

BRANDI
11-17-2001, 02:06 AM
This whole thread could be easly closed by Ray by just saying this:
"Yes, i will reproduce AES rare carts using original SNK boards and ROMs, but to avoid confusions and possibly reselling problems that can harm the Neo scene, i will substantially alter inserts and stickers of these reproductions, so that will be clear to spot the difference beetween the original SNK releases and the reproductions...".
Then, he'll have the whole scene by his side (collectors+gamers).
Hey Ray, is it impossible for you to say this?

waku7
11-17-2001, 02:41 AM
The problem si not who has the knowledge of neo-go or who has not.

The problem is that some american collectors know not the neo geo more than my little sister, and the think they are collectors and neo gamers because they buy motw for 400USd and they read the neo-geo.com all days .
Neo geo it's not that.
And i talked a lot with ftl when he purchased kiz us in france ,i think HE IS a real collector and neo expert.

ps: i don't pretend that i am a neo geo expert, and i don't think i am, but i lov playing my game, and sometimes i have the feeling that for some american collectors neogeo is just money.


Also the neogeo games are just games, but it's a collector thing.
It must not be re-released.
POINT

je vais aps me faire que des potes a mon avis..

[ November 17, 2001: Message edited by: waku7 ]

Caris Nautilus
11-17-2001, 02:56 AM
Originally posted by waku7:
<STRONG>The problem si not who has the knowledge of neo-go or who has not.

The problem is that some american collectors know not the neo geo more than my little sister, and the think they are collectors and neo gamers because they buy motw for 400USd and they read the neo-geo.com all days .
Neo geo it's not that.
And i talked a lot with ftl when he purchased kiz us in france ,i think HE IS a real collector and neo expert.

ps: i don't pretend that i am a neo geo expert, and i don't think i am, but i lov playing my game, and sometimes i have the feeling that for some american collectors neogeo is just money.


Also the neogeo games are just games, but it's a collector thing.
It must not be re-released.
POINT

je vais aps me faire que des potes a mon avis..

[ November 17, 2001: Message edited by: waku7 ]</STRONG>

Hey man, why the hell do you run like a Porn site, but make it look like a Waku 7 site? Kinda wierd...

waku7
11-17-2001, 03:20 AM
it's not a porn homepage!
lol
no, you have 2 ways.
-the way for the guy who like psx, ps2, and doom like who link in charm homepage,like that the guys who like psx and ps2 dont go in my homepage.
the good entry is in left.
if you like old game,s etc..
You cannot really understand the joke if you don't speak french.
Learn french, and you will understand!

[ November 17, 2001: Message edited by: waku7 ]

Caris Nautilus
11-17-2001, 03:28 AM
Originally posted by waku7:
<STRONG>it's not a porn homepage!
lol
no, you have 2 ways.
-the way for the guy who like psx, ps2, and doom like who link in charm homepage,like that the guys who like psx and ps2 dont go in my homepage.
the good entry is in left.
if you like old game,s etc..
You cannot really understand the joke if you don't speak french.
Learn french, and you will understand!

[ November 17, 2001: Message edited by: waku7 ]</STRONG>

Ohh ok, sorry then

<IMG SRC="smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0">

aria
11-17-2001, 05:36 AM
Originally posted by BRANDI:
<STRONG>This whole thread could be easly closed by Ray by just saying this:
"Yes, i will reproduce AES rare carts using original SNK boards and ROMs, but to avoid confusions and possibly reselling problems that can harm the Neo scene, i will substantially alter inserts and stickers of these reproductions, so that will be clear to spot the difference beetween the original SNK releases and the reproductions...".
Then, he'll have the whole scene by his side (collectors+gamers).
Hey Ray, is it impossible for you to say this?</STRONG>

Well, I've mention it at least twice and there was at least some nominal responce in one of his sarcastic posts.

Very professional <IMG SRC="smilies/smirk.gif" border="0">

...then again, this is the Neo Geo scene:
home of the least professional and controvery plagued companies in video games, with only two exceptions:

NCS and Nikke.

I can't think of another major seller that hasn't been blasted:

Buy Rite
NGF
The Neo Store
Super Sellers (R.I.P.)
!Arcade!

All of these have been hit at least one time or another (some more than others).

[ November 17, 2001: Message edited by: Bobak ]

aria
11-17-2001, 05:42 AM
!Arcade! answered the question put to them:

"When and if we do these re-productions keep this in mind they will be re-productions and will be marked as such. The appropriate parties will have been fully compensated if need be and we will have permission to do them. It's not hard to get really all you have to do is ask most of the time and they are happy to give it to you-free."

Now that you have an answer, the more critical among you can hold them to it. Other than that I really think this thread has overlived it usefulness.

Game. Set. Match.
&lt;CLOSED&gt;