KOF 2000 USA owners SPEAK UP!

Dear Forum,

What travesty?!? A moderator ordering a copy of KOF 2000 USA from NGF-USA? Oh no, they must be taking over our minds with those Wiccan spells of theirs! </sarcasm> The following will be a post about NGF-USA and KOF 2000 US. I am mostly making opinions in this post so please feel free to disagree.

Yes, we have all seen innumerable mentions of deals apparently "screwed up" by NGF. These mentions have been continuously expounded on in various forums. We have been subjected to countless reiterations of these mentions, ones obviously meant to be beaten into our collective heads, our minds branded with the notion that NGF is "fake." However, we have also seen confirmations of deals settled in a perfect manner. Very few mentions, scattered and buried by ridicule posts, flaming flotsam, and pornographic imagery. Forum members, it's time for this to end. It does not matter what you think of NGF or what they think of you. Opinions are worthless when they come from the general public. The only people who can justifiably present claims about NGF are ones who have dealt with them, people who have ordered and communicated with them.

With that in mind, I must finalize my decision on what I see as the most legitimate product from NGF to date. I placed a call to SNK-Japan on Wednesday night and upon speaking with two different English speaking representatives, confirmed that NGF-USA should be contacted regarding US versions of KOF2000. They confirmed that NGF-USA has been given US rights only to this game so far, and none other. That being said, I am willing to take a risk on what I see as an officially produced product in Japan, by SNK-Japan, paid for and resold to us by NGF-USA.

It says I am a timid newbie, but anyone who has dealt with me will know me. I am not "Dion," although I have been accused of being him around four or five times and even kicked out of the former circle jerk in Dolphinlord's. I am not here to praise Dion or to kiss his ass because he is just a person and whether you like him or not is your prerogative. I am here only to say that my conversations with Dion have been met with EXTREME professional courtesy and superb communication. I am ordering a KOF2000 US edition from NGF-USA as I would from any other online business and as such expect to be treated in the polite and expedite manner customers are meant to be assured of.

USA versus Japanese versions: it's all about preference, isn't it? How many people if they had a chance to order a US version of KOF2000, would do so from NCS or any other business they are accustomed to dealing with? People say it's about the money, but if there is an exclusive source for an item, the price will be what the market will bear. I look at the US version provided by NGF-USA as strictly that, an SNK-Japan production provided to us by NGF-USA. If they are making a little more profit that they should be, that is their prerogative for the time they have expended in the matter of setting up relationships with SNK-Japan. I personally like the US versions more than the Japanese ones because that is what I have always seen in the stores as a kid. I like the US versions more because of their uniform style and the spine design that looks cohesive on a shelf. I like the US manuals because I am able to read the instructions and my collection in based on aesthetics as much as it is on classic 2-D arcade perfect gaming. With that in mind, I am making a decision to stick to a US collection if a cart is available in said form produced by an official print-house/producer/distributor given those right by the home parent company of SNK-Japan. This is what this version has been advertised as and all evidence points to it so far.

In conclusion, I would like to see some more people like John to step forward and confirm their intentions on purchasing the US version. I am not here to make ass-kiss Dion or be buddy-buddy with anybody I have no relations with. I am here only to state what I have so far experienced. I certainly hope that this transaction meets my usually high expectations as that will signal not only the beginning of a new relationship between NGF-USA and SNK-Japan, but more importantly a stable secure future for the Neo Geo hobby market. After all, we are all in this for the same reason: to play and collect Neo Geo. I look forward to the completion of this transaction with NGF-USA and will inform the forum upon the conclusion with the hopes that we can all put our differences aside and come together. I hope that with this SNK-Japan produced release NGF-USA is able to gather more support in the community and be able to encourage SNK-Japan for future co-operation in terms of US AES releases. We all take risks and the one I have taken is based on substantial evidence to the recently verified legitimacy of NGF-USA as well as communiques with and posts from knowledgeable and trusted members of this community. If any of my points are off-base or slanderous, I welcome non-inflammatory responses. I apologize in advance for any spelling or grammar mistakes made in this haste posting and thank everyone for the time invested in reading this post.

Sincerely,

Kale

I already made it clear that I also called Japan. Once they confirmed that the English version was made by SNK and that NGF was the authorized distributor selling the game I ordered my copy. It should be here today or tomorrow. I can't wait. I'll post more when I get it.

"the frog"

Well Kiselgof, some people just don't give a shit about dealing with unethical, dishonest, and unreliable sellers. You are in the minority on this one, and of course you have the right to spend your money as you see fit, and to state your opinion freely.

But just because you're willing to swallow all the past illegalities, lies, and ripoffs from "NGF", doesn't mean the rest of us will as well. Really, your ability to easily cast aside their past, present, and ongoing bad business practices means that you seem to have little moral concern for the issues, and care only about getting a precious "English" version of KOF2K. Well, get one and enjoy it, even though you're spending almost TWICE the amount for the "English" version as you would for the Japanese one.

If you read the little "FAQ" on the NGF website, one thing comes through very clearly. That is, although NGF made great effort to get other U.S. and foreign distributors interested in their supposed "English" KOF2K cart, none had any interest in dealing with them, and none took them seriously. Does that make you wonder about their reputation? Don't you question why NO retailers will have ANYTHING to do with them, including one of the BEST online retailers, National Console Support? I guess its just one more thing you've overlooked in your eagerness to get a precious "English" cart.

I for one have seen too much evidence of their unethical behavior, including the last set of auctions for FAKE KOF2K (converted) carts, with FAKE inserts, which were being passed off as AUTHENTIC ones. If you read those ridiculous auctions, you'd be blind to miss the condescending, egotistical, and offensive attitudes liberally spread throughout. And of course passing off the fake converted KOF2K as authentic ones, in ANY way, is dishonest and illegal.

And also, the big Neo Geo cart restock, which instead of being sold to Neo gamers at reasonable prices, was instead almost completely usurped by "NGF" and offered at prices substantially raised far above the levels that NCS or VGD would have sold them for. Luckily some people got part of the restock, but the bulk of it was taken by them and probably is still sitting in their basements.

So "kiselgof", waste your money as you wish, but don't expect the rest of the Neo community to suddenly overlook all these past problems and start praising them, and even buying their tainted carts. Its not going to happen, and all you do is impress us with your apparent inability to think through the situation and act in a rational manner. Have fun with your "authentic NGF" KOF2K cart, I'm sure you'll have lots of other NGF buddies to talk to about the great quality of the insert and manual, and how fantastic it looks on your shelf next to all the other REAL carts in the KOF series.

Man i dont fcking believe this.
I hope NGF has the real official SNK KOF2000 US carts cuz this could be the end or begining of their future in reliability.

Man, all who want the KOF2K US cart - get it cuz its a good working cart and if you dont care to confirm the authenticity of the game then thats your wish.

I still dont see/hear any proof anywhere of its SNK originality.
Why not anyone submit any proof they may have?


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Lord Illicious
Primal Massiah
Soul Reaver

Wu Dan Neo Devil of Illness


[This message has been edited by Lord Illicious (edited December 23, 2000).]

Well, I don't own one but I do have a strong feeling this is an authentic SNK made cart. Many people in this forum I'm sure have bought or are in the process of getting one, and I don't blame them either. It's a US version so it does add that extra goodness to your collection. This is extra nice to complete a KOF series set.

The price is high, yes, but if you dont mind the extra cash, what the heck. I personally cant pick one up right this moment, but that dosent mean I wouldn't. NGF does seem to have gotten themselves a spot in the SNK channels and you will see more and more people start to buy stuff from them, especially when the doubts about this cart come to and end. After this, if NGF brings out more of the games they've been talking about you can be you will see more and more people start buying.

This post is not to be taken as an offense or an attack against anybody, just the feelings I have about this cart and NGF's business relationship to the Neo Geo. I am not speaking about their prior deals or any of the much debated topics on these forums, just the business they now present the Neo community.

Just wondering... If the English version of the KOF2000 cart is "official SNK", then why would they leave the barcode off the English version? Wouldn't a real version have a barcode and serial number?

It can be seen from the Neofreak page that the english version is missing the barcode: http://www.neogeofreak.com/kof2000evj.htm

Seems that an "official version" should have an identifing serial number. I wonder if there is even an SNK copyright included on the english version.

[This message has been edited by SmokeYa (edited December 23, 2000).]

True, might have something to do with it only being such a limited run though. Might have figured since only NGF was selling it, why even bother putting a sku on it.

Who cares, $590 for the "NGF" cart (yes, they raised it from $559 to $590 magically) is a fucking joke. Excuse my French, but thats the way I see it. For the price of one of their precious "U.S." carts, you can have TWO Japanese carts. Which is exactly what I have . . .

Originally posted by chimpmeister:
Who cares, $590 for the "NGF" cart (yes, they raised it from $559 to $590 magically) is a fucking joke. Excuse my French, but thats the way I see it. For the price of one of their precious "U.S." carts, you can have TWO Japanese carts. Which is exactly what I have . . .

Click to expand...

Its just way too hard to believe that NGF didnt tamper with thoes carts even if they did get it from SNK.


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Lord Illicious
Primal Massiah
Soul Reaver

Wu Dan Neo Devil of Illness

To be honest I don't desire the U.S. KoF 2K weather it's official or not. Why? Because it's being sold by a pair of people who have no scruples about treating their customers like crap, Poor customer service, and had no respect whatsoever even if they have an 'official' cart which even I still doubt seeing it has No barcode which would symbolize it as a real product and 2nd it has the NeoGeoFreak 'tag' on the bottom with which they had presented the game on their website has magically deemed to 'clip' off to hide the fact it had the NeoGeoFreak 'tag' on it to begin with. Overall if the U.S. version is legit, Fine. I have my Japanese copy and I honestly feel more 'secure' about the game being original then the fair chance it could be a fake. Nuff Said...

BonusKun

Originally posted by chimpmeister:
Who cares, $590 for the "NGF" cart (yes, they raised it from $559 to $590 magically) is a fucking joke. Excuse my French, but thats the way I see it. For the price of one of their precious "U.S." carts, you can have TWO Japanese carts. Which is exactly what I have . . .

Click to expand...

Chimpmeister,

I notice the price change too.

Let people find out for themselves.

William



[This message has been edited by wjw123 (edited December 23, 2000).]

Piece of shit message board. I have just spent 10 minutes typing out a long response only to have it be erased when I forgot to enter my password. My fault thought, since I obviously should have been smart enough to save it in word though. In any case, a shortened less verbose version:

Dear Chimp:

Your points are well-founded but it is very easy to let previous erroneous patterns prevent us from seeing a "diamond in the rough." Price comparisons are not an issue seeing that everything is based on supply and demand as well as what the market will bear. Previous deceptive actions by NGF have been recorded but the issue here is that people have unjustly entered a circle of criticism without examining all the aspects of the NGF-USA/SNK-Japan relationships. NCS and other companies decisions are based more on economical issues meant to prevent any possible fraud that will infringe on their already miniscule profit margin. Any smart business person would deal with a more established business first and foremost.

No need to put my name in quotations as I do not masquerade behind self-imposed nicknames. Each person must make a decision for themselves and the only way to verify the veracity of this latest and most potent offering is to examine it first-hand. I have documented written statements from NGF-USA that state that I will not be enjoying a NGF KOF 2000, but rather an SNK-Japan produced and manufactured and NGF-USA distributed version. I hope that this is the case because it will only signal a possibility that future releases may be provided by SNK-Japan themselves or sold off to other distribution houses such as what happened to Apple and now EEI assuming US market control over SNK properties.

Sincerely,

Kale

Kale is not masquerading. He has different ebay id and address than Chris/ Dion. Infact, I am getting a brand new FF: Special cart from him. He was selling it on this forum, because Ncsx sold him a Jap version instead of Eng. If I understand correctly, NGF sold their stock (From SNK) to NCSX. If Kale was assosiated w/ NGF, why did he have to get FF:SP from them?

Where did the talk of bar-codes on English carts come up from? None of the English carts have bar-codes on the back. Only the Japanese cartridges do. It seems that you people are grapsing at straws now because some of you are still in denial. Face it, this cartridge and it's legitimacy have been proven by many people including myself. Why don't you skeptics call SNK in Japan for yourselves like we all did.

"the frog"

Frog,
Dude. If you had any idea about Neo Games you would KNOW there ARE barcodes for U.S. games. I have several games with barcodes on them inculding Cyberlip which was my 1st Neo Home cart to Samurai Shodown from many other Neo games that had barcodes. Not all of them had them I'll admit, But don't play like you KNOW what you're talking about when you don't. Come up with a new excuse would you please? You only made yourself put your foot in your mouth on that one...

BonusKun

Oh and for proof the barcode numbers for these games I have are as follows

Aero Fighters 2 = 7 24678 24714 6
Alpha Mission 2 = 7 24678 24580 7
Art of Fighting = 7 24678 24601 9
Baseball Stars = 0 21876 00201 1
Crossed Swords = 7 24678 24586 9
Cyberlip = 0 21876 00206 6
Fatal Fury = 7 24678 24590 6
Football Frenzy = 7 24678 24589 0
Ghost Pilots = 7 24678 24581 4
KOF 94 = 7 24678 24718 4
King of Monsters= 7 24678 24575 3

I could list everything I HAVE but I think I made my point. If you're going to lie, try to do it not so anyone can spot it. SNK in their early days had released U.S. home carts with barcodes either on the insert or it was a sticker label which usually had the name of the game which was stuck to the bottom right-hand side of the back of the package where a barcode would have normally been. Next please....

BonusKun

Only some of the early games had bar-codes. And most were stickers, not printed on the inserts. AoF was printed on the insert. But none of the KoF games had them printed on the inserts and none of the newer games after 1995 had them at all. Go check any games after 1995/1996. No more bar-codes. Go check your KoF 95, 96, 97, 98, 99.

"the frog"

<Where did the talk of bar-codes on English carts come up from? None of the English carts have bar-codes on the back. Only the Japanese cartridges do. It seems that you people are grapsing at straws now because some of you are still in denial. Face it, this cartridge and it's legitimacy have been proven by many people including myself. Why don't you skeptics call SNK in Japan for yourselves like we all did.
"the frog">

Doesn't change the fact you lied tho does it? I already said that not ALL U.S. carts had barcodes. You said none of them did. You need to read what people say before you once again type so fast.
Next...

BonusKun

Ok,
I hate these type of debates, cause most people are never willing
to accept that they were wrong.

1st. Barcodes. There are NO barcodes on later US inserts.
Dunno why this came up, but I am holding my official,
shipped direct to me from SNK, Minty fresh US Mark of the Wolves.
No barcode here. nuff said.

2nd.
Profesional Printers absolouty love,
rare prints, special, limited editions. Foil stamped wizzi wigs.
Would they have made a special "press run" just for a US version?
One that might never even be finished & sold.
IMO, Yes. It's quite possible snk's printer would do that.
At very little xtra cost. (Little being relative)

3rd.
Is this all legit? Impossible to tell without having the item in hand.
(Other than calling SNK)
Personally, I trust John. (Geddon01) I leave it in his hands.
Heck, he has worked very hard on his Neo Master List.
He cared enough to put his money where his mouth is.
I respect that.

I really don't care more than passing curiosity.
I think the Japanese insert looks cooler.
If I had liked that US one better, then I would care.
I still would have bought the Japanese, but thats just silly old me.

Nick,
I totally agree. Just one thing I hate is misleading information. I said that some SNK games, Not all of them had barcodes. I was just enlighting the newbie about this seeing as he wasn't so sure of himself in his words. Point taken tho. It's a moot thing but I guess I enjoy debating about them. ^_^

BonusKun

The reason barcodes came up is because the Japanese version of KOF2000 has a barcode but the so called english version does not. Why would they delete the barcode from the english version?

Look at this pic: http://www.neogeofreak.com/kof2000evj.htm

Some of you people must be nutz! NGF = Dion = Asshole. This guy has been claiming his garage made carts were official for years. I mean years! I have not posted in Eons but he was claiming the same shit then. Are some of you people that sorry, gullable and stupid. If his KOF2000 carts were official it would be the first time anything he has ever sold was! His Metal Slug 3 carts were fake. He bought official Japanese versions and replaced them with Photoshop homemade inserts. He has always had a horrible attitude problem. I cant imagine anyone with any common sense wanting anything to do with this guy. I am also not clear as to why the cart should cost $590.00 over the official Japanese version which costs $330. Shit I could have 2 official copies of the Japanese version for not much more than $590.00. Oh well, you spend your money anyway you want. Just remember those of us who remember know that anything from Dion (NGF) in the long wrong will have lost any and all value it had before he decided to alter and modify an official product. Merry XMas - Fatback

Welcome back Fatback!! You've been gone a LONG time it seems . . . and its good that you can bring your experience from YEARS ago to this discussion.

If you want to talk about carts that lose money it is always the jap versions. KoF2K on ebay aren't even getting $300. And it's only been a few days since the release. That version will drop in price just as the Jap KoF 99 did. For all the people that paid $332 or $399 for their jap KoF2K carts, I feel sorry for you. You may want to try and sell them now before they lose even more value. Sell it and get the English version.

"the frog"

Look these are the points everyone is missing

Lets assume that NGF is a official distributor of SNK Home carts. Now this in no way makes them a branch of snk like an SNK USA, everyone knows there is not longer a US interest for SNK other then MVS.

Now, Take apple and EEI for instance, they were/are Distributors of SNK MVS carts. yet the MVS carts they release did not have Apple or EEI anywhere on the mvs artwork.

Now what is the Job of a Distributor, Of course to Move SNK product through the commerence system of the coutry they are distributors for. Is this the Goal of NGF? I doubt it, Just because of the fact that they are raising thier prices and wanting a collector price on an Item. so either SNK printed the inserts for them (questionable I do not doubt they sent them the files of the artwork though to work with) or they did it all themselves. Either way I know it did not cost $300 extra to put together. After all is not NGF giving away thier inserts for free now?

Anyway becuase of this I will not be the unproud owner of a english version of KOF 2000. Call it what you will, Official or not. but this is Business and I choose not to do business with organizations that are not benefiting me as a consumer or the company they are suppose to represent.

And I hope no one is going to be foolish to believe that on NGF's next home cart conversion release it is going to now be a official SNK cart. Cause I would like to see if someone has a problem with it call snk for service.

now the argument of the bar code is true. the newer US releases did not have it. They do however have "MADE in JApan" on them which the NGF cart does not. Take that for what it is worth.

The thing with the English KoF2K is that not only is NGF distributing it, they purchased the exclusive rights. That's why they had their url placed on the insert. These can all be answered and confirmed by calling SNK in Japan.

"the frog"