More pirate chips found in KOF 97 and 99

Well people, the bastardized spin master is not the only one <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">

I told my local arcade distributor about the spin master/world heroes fake and he laughed bad <IMG SRC="smilies/eek2.gif" border="0">

He said: "Don't you know about that?" <IMG SRC="smilies/drool2.gif" border="0">

"If you want, I can sell you a kof 97 and a half"

"What the fuck is that", I said <IMG SRC="smilies/eek.gif" border="0">

"it's a kof 97 with a say, custom-chip on it, that lets you play with three additional fighters", the dealer said

"same thing with the kof 99", he added.

FUCK man!!! that shit about pirate add-on chips happens in my city too!!!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/mad.gif" border="0">

Ever heard about the "kof 97 and a half" and "kof 99 and a half"?

Maybe I could begin a page with fucked-up rare-altered-fixed-tricked-bastardized-hybrid MVS!!! <IMG SRC="smilies/loco.gif" border="0">

Who supplied you with these F*! Carts.
That will help us all stay clear from them in the future.
And again.Sorry to hear about your situation.
-BB

Call me crazy, but those sound cool! Does it ruin the game to have more in there? I mean, does it glitch it up, or?

Sure, they aren't the real thing, but hey... they sound sort of neat, if they work well.

Spike

What the hell? I want one! Just one, just to see what it's like. I think that World Heroes/Spinmaster cart should be a valued item to the Neo world. I'd REALLY like to see pics of the game once you have the switch installed. Or you can sell it to me. <IMG SRC="smilies/wink.gif" border="0">

Since SNK has been vaporized into oblivion, all the fake carts are available through the local Mexican market. The first chips were imported from Korea, but now all the arcade dealers know how to produce those chips in Mexico.

As a matter of fact, the Kof 97 and a half chip was developed here in Mexico City, as my dealer told me.

The games play like silk, nop glitches no shit on it, just extra fighters, or hybrid carts.

Nevertheless, FUCK those guys <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0"> , they are taking advantage of a defenseless non-existent company in Mexico.

Let me tell you that I am an Intellectual Property attorney, full time. Just admitted last year, and all this shit really fucks me up <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0">

The problem is that those guys cannot get busted, since the owner of the rights (formerly SNK, and now Capcom of Mexico) is not interested in filing legal procedures against those fuckers, cause they think that Neo Geo is obsolete technology and fighting for it will represent bigger costs thatn earnings.

Well, all I can say is Fuck pirates <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0">

The KOF 99 was for sale here, we all saw the picts of that with the one magical chip and little blue wire... but back then everyone said it was cool, cause it let you play Kyo and Iori, and Krizalid without code immediatly on the Arcade. Some even said this was SNK official... I would not freak out about this, yeah the games are hacked/pirated... and I bet you got them from Cosmico in Hong Kong... I have gotten a few boots there too... but the point is, they work, and you got them probably for a lot cheaper then what they are worth...

-Nick

I really dont see the problem with it as long as the board and chips are SNK original. All these people are doing is making a "Game Genie" type add-on to allow those various hacks. This has been happening for years. Pacman hacks, Street Fighter II hacks, MK hacks, everything hacks. People buy them to have a different feel to the game, etc. I dont see that as illegal or copyright infrenging. It's wrong if they do not tell you up front what your buying, and that should be stoped. If someone wants to buy one, let em, I dont see it as wrong... As far as I know these can be removed and the game is brought back to original condition, so there is no perminant damage. I dont know....

Yeah, I bought the KOF 99 1/2 on MVS. I knew what was in the game before I bought it. I like the fact I don't have to enter a code to play as Krizald. I actually think the game is worth a little more with that little "add-on" It was professionally done, so I don't think that there is any harm to the game. I actually got a great deal on the game when I bought it. There are no glitches or what not in it. If I want to return the game to original status I would just undsolder the wire. Well....just letting you know that I have a KOF 99 SE!! <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

Some legal lessons,

IT IS against the law to hack those carts.

1.- The chips are not developed by SNK and as a result of the installation, the copyrighted game is being distorted or modified. (It is not unlocking shit inside the rom, it is ADDING crap to it)

2.- The fucker developing and selling the pirated chips, is earning money at expense of the reputation of a modified copyrighted material (the game itself, the characters, the music, etc.)

3.- SNK (or Capcom) has not granted a license nor an express consent to the chip developers.

4.- The fuckers developing chips are infringing patent rights, as well as integrated circuit layouts that might have been registered.

5.- Etc.

Do not talk about what you can´t, or dont know!!!

Fuck pirates and hackers <IMG SRC="smilies/veryangry.gif" border="0">

I always love being yelled at. I can talk about what I do know and I can give my opinion. If I am mistaken a simple notice would be nice, not a outright order. Very very offenceive.

Since your a lawyer and you know everything about copyright laws world wide and know everything about how these hackers make these chips, I would like to know how they can do this. What do you base this on, have you seen them rip code out of a existing SNK chip, have you read the code inside the chip? From the chip I saw in djbomermans KOF99 it did not look like a ROM chip at all.

I dont THINK the hack chip developers are putting any copyrighted material in it, no sprites nothing like that. I THINK they are just lines of code like you would in a Game Genie. Thats what I THINK. I do not know this.

They may be infrenging some sort of copyright laws in taking existing hardware and modifying it etc, but your not complaining about conversions and the MVS converters that have been in the Neo scene, which seem to be "infrenging patent rights on circut layouts" etc. These are commonplace in the Neo scene, and a seems to be accepted.

Another question, you said

"(formerly SNK, and now Capcom of Mexico)"

When did this happen? Capcom of Mexico bought SNK of Mexico? I find this very interesting, as to it has never been mentioned here or in any other publication that I have read. I'm confused...

I understand your hostility, actually now that I think about it, I dont... Calm the fuck down. PLease!

I can almost guarantee that the code on the KOF99 chip simply made the KYO and IORI code set to on by default, and used a similar trick to unlock Krizalid. This would mean they added nothing, but did indeed unlock features already in the code... how does this effect the copyright of a game. If I enter the IORI code and get IORI, or use this chip to get him it is the same thing! If you understand the way Assembly language (or any language for that matter) works, you understand states, all these codes did was put the condition for these states. If someone hacked in with Street Fighter Characters into KOF 99 that would be adding already copyrighted material to the game, but as is, the KOF 99 game atleast, does not violate any copy right laws for making the three in game characters playable. Actually the last time I heard anything about it there were a whole bunch of hidden people locked in that game. People found new customes of everyone and a few never before seen characters when they were looking through the ROM. All of these lay dorment in the chips, and could later be unlocked.

-Nick

[ May 24, 2001: Message edited by: nruva ]

I'd bet that the extra characters on the above mentioned KOF 97 and a half, are probably the bosses. Who are already programed inside the existing ROMs. I am most likely going to be visiting Mexico City in July and I would love to visit this arcade distributer and see exactly how these are done.

Alright, I apologize for my hostility Neoturfmasta.

Now, about the legal stuff that is still pending...

If you modify a copyrighted work, you must have the consent of the owner.

If someone is modifying a copyrighted material, and (in this particular examples that you guys have posted) unlocks some information that has been intended as secret, or unlockable with a code, this person is going beyond the limits of your rights as an owner of a legally aquired copy.

The latter, due to the fact that inside of the marketing of the copyrighted software, the secret players provide an extra interest or enhance the replay value of a game.

If someone is developing chips to overpass this features, this person is among other things, obtaining earnings out of a copyrighted material that has been modified, and will make the company lose money, or simply change a marketing plan.

Reverse ingeneering will be aceptable in the event of a search for new technologies, or for research purposes. Nevertheless, in the case of kof 97 1/2, the chip has been made to clearly boost the interest of old or outdated games at some arcade centers.

About Snk of Mexico. The company existed for many years, being focused on the arcade market. It was an authorized and exclusive distributor of Snk in Mexico. As you may know, Capcom was intending to buy all the intellectual property rights from Snk. In Mexico, Capcom has undertaken SNK, and all the official snk merchandise that was kept in stock, is now available at Capcom of Mexico. Hence, Capcom of Mexico has been talking about obatining licences for the copyrighted material of Snk. I don't know for sure if the said licences have been executed up to date, or if there's only a distribution contract between them.

So, are we cool? <IMG SRC="smilies/cool.gif" border="0">

Also, the usage of these chips will kill the interest in the game if released at an early stage of the life of the game. That's why unlockable characters must be used at a time when the game can regain interest, not at the beginning which will screw the marketing plan of the copyright owner, the useful life of the game and thus, his earnings.

Yeah, were cool...

I understand what your saying, and I understand that this can be a issue when profit is a concern. I believe it is wrong for a arcade, whos buisness it is to make money, to use any such tactics to so. I dont, however see it as being a major issue for collectors/gamers who are looking for this type of thing for themselvs. A lot of people get the debug chip installed in their home cart system for these very features. This right and wrong issue is purely a matter of opinion. We use the information given to make your own personal decision on what you find ethical and not. I respect your opinion, but I dont completely agree. But hey, thats life, it makes things more interesting.

I definately appreciate the information on CAP/SNK of Mex. Very interesting indeed. When I do go out to Mexico City, I'd love to visit some of the local arcade/game shops. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Also, the usage of these chips will kill the interest in the game if released at an early stage of the life of the game. That's why unlockable characters must be used at a time when the game can regain interest, not at the beginning which will screw the marketing plan of the copyright owner, the useful life of the game and thus, his earnings.

Click to expand...

Well legality aside, I really dont see much wrong with it morally.
Kof97 is an old game, its earning days are over.
If a small hack helps revitalizes intrest in
an snk game somewhere in mexico, who are we to cry foul?

You would still have to have bought the game at some point.
That supports SNK.
If you wanna toy with it or beat it with a hammer you can.

Personally, Id love to see one of these Kof97 & a half carts.

Alright, alright people.

My final issue is:

1.- The chips are cool if used by collectors.

2.- The chips are not cool if used at a moment in which the game's useful life or profits can be affected.

3.- Since quite some dudes are interested in the Kof 97 1/2, Kof 99 1/2, and Hybrid Carts like Spin Master/World Heroes, I can tell the guys over here to contact you, and arrange a trade or something with them.

We are all true-gamers, and love SNK for the great moments that until today, we are having.

Thanks, for ALL your opinions, this is what a forum is intended for.

kanjifreak. <IMG SRC="smilies/smile.gif" border="0">

I never heard about these counterfiets but I would believe it. I remember when Street Fighter II was big I remember piracy was bad with one, and I even saw counterfeit games in various places. And I am in the U.S.

Yep. Steet Fighter 2, well Cps-1 harware in general is considered the most bootleged hardware in arcade history. Looks like MVS may take that title away from them.

Actually, I am interested in seeing what these guys have to offer. If they have a email address, have them email me. I'm going to be in Mexico City July 19 for about a week or so. My girlfriend is from there and were going to visit some relatives. I'll have some free time to shop for games. If you have a chance email me any places you think I should visit. thanks.

splurge@satx.rr.com

I know counterfeit exists in many type of profitable commodities. However, I never have any knowledge of how a piratic Neo Geo game is made. Thanks for the sea of information.