building a pc

I know someone else started this topic.

I went to <a href="http://www.tigerdirect.com" target="_blank">www.tigerdirect.com</a> and I am pricing out some stuff.

As far as I can see, this package that I am building is a pretty good deal because almost the exact same system from dell is $2500-2800... and don't knock dell because I love them... and at work here that is all we'll put in unless I build something.

I know what I am doing, but I am curious as to what you all think about the following items (IE a second opinion):

Product Description Quantity Unit Price Ext. Price



MBM-P4VDA-2400
Soyo P4VDA Socket 478 Motherboard w/ P4 2.4 GHz

$259.99
$259.99


S59-1914
Sky Elec 512MB PC2100 ECC DDR 266MHz

$84.99
$169.98


B700-1190
Buslink 56x CD-ROM Internal

$39.99
$39.99


A453-1056
Antec SX-1040B II Black Case (10-Bay) w/400 PS

$109.75
$109.75


B20-5080 P
Belkin 10/100 PCI Network Card

$9.99
$9.99


C44-5025
Creative Labs SB Audigy XGamer PCI Sound Card

$84.99
$84.99


F451-9128
ATI Radeon 9000 128MB AGP Video Card by FIC

$129.99
$129.99


M17-8064
Microsoft Wheel Mouse Optical

$19.99
$19.99


A450-1012B
Windows Multifunction Black Kybrd w/123 Keys PS/2

$14.99
$14.99


A162-2020
Altec XA3051 100Watt 6Pc Gaming Speaker System

$69.97
$69.97


THD-1200JB P
WD Caviar 120GB EIDE HD 7200/8MB/8.9/ATA-100

$164.99
$164.99


TC1-6000 BL
1.44MB Floppy Disk Drive (Black)

$19.99
$19.99


Click to remove an item from your cart. Product Subtotal*: $1,094.61
Estimated Shipping*: $42.97


The cut/paste screwed up... but on the items... the 1st price is the "price of 1 unit" and the second price is the total for "all units I am buyin for that item."

Please let me know what you think.

I am also curious on the ECC memory I have chosen. Have ANY of you experienced a greater advantage to ECC as to non-ECC.
I know ECC is used a lot in servers... but for a home system?

thanks!
†B†V†

ECC memory is slightly slower, don't bother, you won't need it at home.

another thing I am worried about is that the case has the following:
Cooling System
- 4 x 80mm fans
- 1 front (Optional)
- 2 rear (Standard)
- 1 HDD (Optional)


Dumb question, but will that be enough for the graphics card & processor to keep cool?


*Edit* Does anyone like the Sky ram? or would you prefer PNY? actually... has anyone heard anything bad about the sky ram?

†B†V†

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Bluevoodu ]</small>

4x80mm fans?

Dude I should think so:

I run dual cpu's and a gf2 (yeah its old) but I've got nowhere near 4 fans .. 2 maybe, and its fine.

sweet.

And um.... one last thing.

Would you get a CRT or LCD monitor?

I know the CRT's look better... but the Flat Panel LCD's are nice for desk space...etc.
I have worked with few LCD monitors.... and I wasn't too happy... but I am looking at a dell branded monitor with .26 mm dot pitch, 1280x1024 pixels, 16.7 million color 24 bit...
17inch of course... at 17 inch screen size, I don't want more than that. $549 w/ free shipping.


*edit* I hate to doubt my decision.. but I always am.
Here is the description of the mother board.... does this sound pretty good for the money?
<a href="http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=MBM-P4VDA-2400" target="_blank">web page</a>


and the new price of the computer I am building
w/out monitor is now up to $1237.58 shipped.
That sound a little expensive....
I changed out the DDR Ram for non-ecc and the PNY brand costs $139 per 512 as opposed to the $89 per 512 the Sky does.
Would you go with the "sky" brand... I am a little hesitant to.

Thanks again!
†B†V†

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 02:01 PM: Message edited by: Bluevoodu ]</small>

Go for PNY RAM, get a High Quality natural flat CRT.

Nuff said.

cool

Do you think that dell monitor sounds great. IMO with the dot pitch, colors, pixels it is great. I don't care for anything greater than 1280X1024.


thanks!
†B†V†

I only use 1280.. but I suppose 1600 would be nice if you have the cash.

/me shrugs

Go for Corsair Ram.... they are supposedly the best. You can overclock them with very little problem.

And the reasons for overclocking a 2.4Ghz CPU would be.... ?

I'm not so sure that's a good deal, sounds pricey to me. And the motherboard doesn't look that great, this is the RAM it supports:

Memory
- DDR266 SDRAM
- Three DDR 2.5V DIMM sockets support up to 3 GB
- 184-pin PC2100/PC1600 non-ECC, unbuffered DDR SDRAM memory

If I read that correctly, it only supports RAM with 266 FSB, and it supports a CPU FSB of 400. You're better off getting a mobo that supports 400 FSB for the RAM as well, you'll get better performance. RAM is also up to PC3200 now as well, much faster.

And I assume you want better performance, that's why you're buying a sound card and network card when the motherboard has them integrated?

Something tells me that motherboard is old, that's why they bundled it with the CPU. I couldn't find that model on <a href="http://www.newegg.com" target="_blank">www.newegg.com</a> at all, although maybe I missed it.

I'm putting together a PC for a friend, it is very comparable to yours. It has no HD, and it uses an AMD CPU. I'd be happy to post the information if you'd like to compare? The price is only $413.

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: Rigel ]</small>

<a href="http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=I69-2015" target="_blank">http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=I69-2015</a>

I switched to a different motherboard.
This intel board only allows 2gb of ram... but it supports the full 533 FSB, and i think the better ram of what you are saying.

If you want, take a look.
Tell me if this one sounds better

EDIT: sure, please post what you are doing for your friend. I do have 2 Hard Drives... 1 120 gig and 1 80 gig. Both are 7200 rpm western digital drives. the 80 gig will be for the OS and files needed for the OS.. and a part will be partioned off for "program files" but that drive will LARGELY remain untouched to keep it "more pure" if you will

I also do not want/like AMD processors... for personal reasons. what comparible clock does the AMD processor run at that you are using??

Thanks,
†B†V†

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 04:13 PM: Message edited by: Bluevoodu ]</small>

I would order from newegg since you live in Indiana. You won't have to pay sales tax and they pretty much have the cheapest prices around the net.

What do you plan on using this computer for?

If you do alot of Adobe and Video rendering you might as well spring for a HyperThreading cpu.

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: Deyer ]</small>

Bluevoodu:
<a href="http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=I69-2015" target="_blank">http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=I69-2015</a>

I switched to a different motherboard.
This intel board only allows 2gb of ram... but it supports the full 533 FSB, and i think the better ram of what you are saying.

Click to expand...

It's better. I think the DDR333 RAM is PC2700, that's not too bad. They have the same mobo at <a href="http://www.newegg.com" target="_blank">www.newegg.com</a> for 9 dollars less, and free shipping.

<a href="http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=D845PEBT2" target="_blank">http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=&submit=Go&description=D845PEBT2</a>

You're really going to get the extra network card when the motherboard has integrated network?

Oh, and here:

<a href="http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=27-106-184&DEPA=1" target="_blank">http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=27-106-184&DEPA=1</a>

For $48 you can get a good CD burner from ASUS. That's only 9 dollars more than the plain old CD drive you list above.

got a cd burner alreayd 48X12X48
pretty sweet stuff.

Actually, here is my new setup so far, I changed some stuff around.

A453-1056
Antec SX-1040B II Black Case (10-Bay) w/400 PS

$109.75
$109.75


A177-3020
ATI Radeon 9000 PRO 128MB AGP

$149.99
$149.99


THD-1200JB P
WD Caviar 120GB EIDE HD 7200/8MB/8.9/ATA-100

$164.99
$164.99


THD-80JB P
WD Caviar 80GB EIDE HD 7200/8MB/8.9/ATA-100

$119.99
$119.99


P56-1904
PNY 512MB PC2100 DDR Memory (266MHz)

$134.99
$269.98


B700-1190
Buslink 56x CD-ROM Internal

$39.99
$39.99


I69-2015
Intel 845PEBT2 Socket 478 Motherboard

$129.99
$129.99


CP2-P4-2400BNC
Intel P4 2.4Ghz 512k Cache,533FSB SocN 478

$189.99
$189.99


M17-7702
Microsoft Intellimoue Optical Explorer & Cable

$29.99
$29.99


A450-1012B
Windows Multifunction Black Kybrd w/123 Keys PS/2

$14.99
$14.99


C44-5025
Creative Labs SB Audigy XGamer PCI Sound Card

$84.99
$84.99


A162-2026
Altec 221 50Watt Total Speaker System Power

$34.97
$34.97


Click to remove an item from your cart. Product Subtotal*: $1,339.61
Estimated Shipping*: $33.76


So far.. I am happy with this, but... I will check out the other place to see if it would save any money. Really... this is not too bad of a deal as I have checked out other places. It seems at other places, you give some $ on a few items and take some $ on others, you know?

I am trying to decide if the extra $9 + free shipping is worth ordering the part from another place.

What do you think so far?


*edit* i use the PC for doing web pages. Playing games (duh lol..), and rendering images & animations. I render Bryce 5 images or scenes and animated scenes.

I do a lot of graphics editing...etc. and I need something powerful to do this with 4-5 other graphics programs open. My P2 266Mhz w/ 300 ram is actually doing a hell of a good job. Its time to upgrade though... I cannot stand the choppyness that it gets after awhile.

†B†V†

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 04:25 PM: Message edited by: Bluevoodu ]</small>

I am an AMD guy, so thats the only thing I would change

lol... not for me man lol.

Anyways... DANGIT I WANT THIS FRIGGIN GRAPHICS CARRD!
ATI All-In-Wonder RADEON 9700 PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP

I remember the days when the newest and best cards were $250 MAX..... except for those Oxygen cards... they were $500+.

$385 for an ATI


BTw... does the price look ok for what I am getting though?

†B†V†

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 04:31 PM: Message edited by: Bluevoodu ]</small>

Bluevoodu:
sure, please post what you are doing for your friend. I do have 2 Hard Drives...

I also do not want/like AMD processors... for personal reasons. what comparible clock does the AMD processor run at that you are using??

Click to expand...

The AMD in question is the Athlon XP 2400+. It's fine with me if you don't like AMD. But here's what I'm look'n at for a friend:

-----------------------------
Motherboard
-----------------------------
CHAINTECH Motherboard for AMD Processors, Model# 7NIF2-SUMMIT NFORCE2/IGP u-ATX-RETAIL
Specifications:
Supported CPU:AMD Socket A Duron/Athlon XP
Chipset:NVIDIA nForce2, IGP + MCP
FSB:200/266/333MHz
RAM:3x184Pin DDR 1600/2100/2700/3200 Dual Channel DDR
IDE:UDMA 66/100/133 PCI IDE up to 4 Devices
Slots:1xAGP (4x8x) 3x PCI and GFORCE4 MX GRAPHICS EMBEDDED TV-OUT (S-VIDEO) 1x ACR Slot
Ports:2xPS2,2xCOM,1xLPT,1xFDD, and Audio Ports
Onboard Audio: 4-channel (CMEDIA 9738)
Onboard LAN:10/100 MBS
Price: $99
Shipping: Free
----------------------------------
RAM
----------------------------------
CRUCIAL MICRON 256MB 32x64 PC 2700 DDR RAM - OEM
184-Pin, CL=2.5-Unbuffered 2.5V, 6-Layers CT3264Z335 Requires DDR supported Motherboard - Lifetime Warranty. OEM -OEM
Price: $39 (x2) = $78
Shipping: Free
(NOTE: getting two sticks because the on onboard video is a Gefroce4 MX 128 MB, and it requres two RAM slots for maximum performance. The integrated video with the nforce2 chipset is very comparably to the radeon 9000 you specify, although not quite as good)
---------------------------------
CD Drive
---------------------------------
Lite On 52x24x52 CDRW Model LTR-52246S Retail Buffer underrun error free & automatically adjust writing strategy plus running OPC to meet various burning condition.
Specifications:
Speed : Recording 52Xmax CAV Re-writing 24X High-Speed CLV Reading 52Xmax CAV
Interface : ATAPI-E/IDE, support up to Ultra-DMA Mode2 33.3MB/sec
Access Time : 80ms
Buffer Memory Size: 2MB
Operating System : Windows 95/98/NT/XP/2000/ME
Price: $48
shipping: Free
------------------------------------
Case
------------------------------------
Enermax, CS-3051L-S3A. SILVER, Aluminum Silver and Plastic Front Panel with Acrylic Cover. 10-Bay, Enermax Logo side Window, Sound Sensitive Neon Light. 2 x USB, 1 x MIC, 1 x headphone ports at front. POWERUP 350W P-4 power supply, Mid ATX Tower Case ATX. 4 X 5.25" Bays, 2 X 3.5" Bays, 4 X 3.5" Hidden. Dimensions: 486 x 200 x 427mm
Price: $57
Shipping: $10
<a href="http://www.newegg.com/app/Showimage.asp?image=11-124-042-11.JPG/11-124-042-19.jpg/11-124-042-13.JPG/11-124-042-14.JPG/11-124-042-15.JPG/11-124-042-16.JPG/11-124-042-17.JPG/11-124-042-08.JPG/11-124-042-18.JPG" target="_blank">http://www.newegg.com/app/Showimage.asp?image=11-124-042-11.JPG/11-124-042-19.jpg/11-124-042-13.JPG/11-124-042-14.JPG/11-124-042-15.JPG/11-124-042-16. JPG/11-124-042-17.JPG/11-124-042-08.JPG/11-124-042-18.JPG</a>
----------------------------------
CPU
----------------------------------
AMD ATHLON XP 2400 /266 FSB PROCESSOR CPU - RETAIL
Specifications:
CPU: 2.0 GHz
Type: XP 2400 + Thoroughbred
Cache: 256K
BUS: 266 MHz
Socket: A Retail (Box with Heatsink and Fan)
Price: $135
Shipping: Free
-------------------------------------------
Total: $427 (including shipping)
-------------------------------------------

And like I said, no HD included in this. My friend's don't require anything big, so I'm putting an old 11 giger in there for now.

So, it's comparable to the 2.4 gig intel, and the other items you have selected.

Bluevoodu:
BTw... does the price look ok for what I am getting though?

†B†V†

Click to expand...

The RAM looks pricey, you should try Crucial RAM, it's very good. Check this out:

On Sale! CRUCIAL MICRON 512MB 64x64 PC 2700 DDR RAM - OEM
184-Pin, CL=2.5-Unbuffered Non Parity 2.5V, CT6464Z335 Requires DDR supported Motherboard - Lifetime Warranty. OEM
Price: $68 each
Shipping: Free

Faster than what you have up there too!

The CPU looks expensive too. You should really compare your prices with <a href="http://www.newegg.com" target="_blank">www.newegg.com</a> (CPU is $159 there), they beat the price on almost everything you list, and almost everything they sell has free shipping.

(hmmm, so I'm pro-AMD and pro-newegg, sweet!)

<small>[ April 02, 2003, 04:38 PM: Message edited by: Rigel ]</small>

yeah, for the items selected.... its about the exact same

darnit... I was hoping to build something for less than $1000.

but I need at least a 2.4 GHZ.. and I say the price that I found for this on tiger is about the best I have found.

plus I am going to need all the other items because once I get this PC, my other PC has to go straight back to the office. None of the original Equipment except for my 27 gig, and CD burner are leaving the case..

I gotta get a monitor too... but I am getting one off dell as stated above. If I could afford it, I would have just bought a dell lol. but I am saving about $700-800 this way. Since I am a student, I can get All the windows products $5 each.

†B†V†

Rigel:

Bluevoodu:
BTw... does the price look ok for what I am getting though?

†B†V†

Click to expand...

The RAM looks pricey, you should try Crucial RAM, it's very good. Check this out:

On Sale! CRUCIAL MICRON 512MB 64x64 PC 2700 DDR RAM - OEM
184-Pin, CL=2.5-Unbuffered Non Parity 2.5V, CT6464Z335 Requires DDR supported Motherboard - Lifetime Warranty. OEM
Price: $68 each
Shipping: Free

Faster than what you have up there too!

Click to expand...

thats a good price, but have you used it before? What is the reliability?

I don't want something that will burn up within a few months lol
trust me, I have seen it happen. The programs I use are MEMORY HOGS. IE... Corel Draw and Corel Photo paint open at the same time CAN take half my memory or 150 meg supposively...
plus with Bryce 5 open and rendering.... dang 8 second animations take like 6-8 hours to render

†B†V†

Rigel:
I'm not so sure that's a good deal, sounds pricey to me. And the motherboard doesn't look that great, this is the RAM it supports:

Memory
- DDR266 SDRAM
- Three DDR 2.5V DIMM sockets support up to 3 GB
- 184-pin PC2100/PC1600 non-ECC, unbuffered DDR SDRAM memory

If I read that correctly, it only supports RAM with 266 FSB, and it supports a CPU FSB of 400. You're better off getting a mobo that supports 400 FSB for the RAM as well, you'll get better performance. RAM is also up to PC3200 now as well, much faster.

And I assume you want better performance, that's why you're buying a sound card and network card when the motherboard has them integrated?

Something tells me that motherboard is old, that's why they bundled it with the CPU. I couldn't find that model on <a href="http://www.newegg.com" target="_blank">www.newegg.com</a> at all, although maybe I missed it.

I'm putting together a PC for a friend, it is very comparable to yours. It has no HD, and it uses an AMD CPU. I'd be happy to post the information if you'd like to compare? The price is only $413.

Click to expand...

Just to clear up something about DDR RAM
DDR PC2100 - Actual Bus speed 133MHz.
DDR PC2700 - Actual Bus speed 166MHz.
DDR PC3200 - Actual Bus speed 200MHz.

Remember DDR(Double Data Rate) memory is clocked on the leading and trailing edge of the Front side bus clock.
The only memory currently rated for native 400, 566, 600MHz is RDRAM. So is the only RAM that can reliably used with motherboards that have an "actual" Front side bus speeds of 400MHz+.
Just an FYI for RAM.

wth?

Seems exspensive to me.

I bought an off the shelf pc w/ these stats for 380$:

P4 1.6 ghz - as fast as you could really need
512 mb of ram
128 mb nvidia graphics card (fancy one)
cd-rw
dvdrom

I don't know why your pc would be so exspensive >_<

so why would the board with 533 FSB be designed for 266mhz DDR Pc2100?

†B†V†

snkneogeousaCTH:
wth?

Seems exspensive to me.

I bought an off the shelf pc w/ these stats for 380$:

P4 1.6 ghz - as fast as you could really need
512 mb of ram
128 mb nvidia graphics card (fancy one)
cd-rw
dvdrom

I don't know why your pc would be so exspensive >_<

Click to expand...

I'd like to know where off the shelf. Even the crap at best buy is near this... kid you not.

I scoped 5 of our local PC stores... and they are all $300-500 above this.

Where did you get yours that cheap?

†B†V†