US to send another 100,000 troops to Iraq!

In what can only be seen as an admission that the 'Liberation' of Iraq is not exactly going to script, the USA has decided to send another 100,000 Soldiers to help pursuade the Iraqi populace that Liberation is indeed in their best interests.

Currently, The UK is providing almost a third of all fighting men, and a third of all Tanks.

The UK government has said that no more troops will be sent from the UK.
The basic translation of that is that they are busy doing the Firefighters jobs for them when the are on strike, and simply cannot be spared.

If you believe that's an "admission" of guilt, you're quite misinformed.

Force escalation is a VERY common military move. Why have ALL of your troops over there and have them all burn out when you can stagger them and keep some fronts fairly fresh. While things may have slowed south of Baghdad, with the 173rd jumping into the north AND with fresh feet on the ground they have a VERY good strategy in place.

Like most peaceniks, you would like nothing more that to marginalize some smart military moves and common procedures and declare this war a failure in a week. I'm sorry, but if you've effectively overran 75% of a country in 7 days... I don't know how you slice it, it's NOT a bad campaign.

It's not a matter of 'convincing' anyone of anything. It's a matter of a brutal asshole who slaughters his own people being deposed. If you lived in a society where things are as repressed as that one is for SO long.. you grow accustomed to it, whether you like it or not.

It's also a matter of this guy violating the UN sanctions imposed on him and finally bringing the hammer down on him. He dicked around long enough.

I'm sure you're one of those people that thinks because the Iraqis haven't come running into american soldiers and surrendering en masse that they love Saddam. One thing is they still remember the last time we were there and we just pulled out and let a lot of people die. They aren't easily convinced now.

They don't like Saddam, but they also don't want the US running the country because of how "evil" that the Middle East thinks we are. That's the reason why there is more resistance this time. LAst time was just booting them from Kuwait.. now it's a battle for their homes which they think they might lose. It stirs a different emotion.


If you think this war is so unjust, why not go get some archival footage of what Saddam did to the Kurds in the late '80s and the Shia revolt in '92... then tell me that this guy shouldn't be ousted. He's a fucking scumbag and while we (the US/UK) might not be the saints of this world, somebody needs to step up to the plate and do something about it. I'm proud that our countries have decided that even against public opinion in some cases (not an issue anymore.. the polls show support), they needed to do the 'right' thing.

How long did you think this war would last?

Were you predicting that the US would deploy this many troops?

When Metal Slug says admission that the war is not going to script, that is not a pseudonym for admission of guilt.

VanillaThunder:
If you believe that's an "admission" of guilt, you're quite misinformed.

Force escalation is a VERY common military move. Why have ALL of your troops over there and have them all burn out when you can stagger them and keep some fronts fairly fresh. While things may have slowed south of Baghdad, with the 173rd jumping into the north AND with fresh feet on the ground they have a VERY good strategy in place.

Like most peaceniks, you would like nothing more that to marginalize some smart military moves and common procedures and declare this war a failure in a week. I'm sorry, but if you've effectively overran 75% of a country in 7 days... I don't know how you slice it, it's NOT a bad campaign.

It's not a matter of 'convincing' anyone of anything. It's a matter of a brutal asshole who slaughters his own people being deposed. If you lived in a society where things are as repressed as that one is for SO long.. you grow accustomed to it, whether you like it or not.

It's also a matter of this guy violating the UN sanctions imposed on him and finally bringing the hammer down on him. He dicked around long enough.

I'm sure you're one of those people that thinks because the Iraqis haven't come running into american soldiers and surrendering en masse that they love Saddam. One thing is they still remember the last time we were there and we just pulled out and let a lot of people die. They aren't easily convinced now.

They don't like Saddam, but they also don't want the US running the country because of how "evil" that the Middle East thinks we are. That's the reason why there is more resistance this time. LAst time was just booting them from Kuwait.. now it's a battle for their homes which they think they might lose. It stirs a different emotion.


If you think this war is so unjust, why not go get some archival footage of what Saddam did to the Kurds in the late '80s and the Shia revolt in '92... then tell me that this guy shouldn't be ousted. He's a fucking scumbag and while we (the US/UK) might not be the saints of this world, somebody needs to step up to the plate and do something about it. I'm proud that our countries have decided that even against public opinion in some cases (not an issue anymore.. the polls show support), they needed to do the 'right' thing.

Click to expand...

VanillaThunder:
If you believe that's an "admission" of guilt, you're quite misinformed.

Force escalation is a VERY common military move. Why have ALL of your troops over there and have them all burn out when you can stagger them and keep some fronts fairly fresh. While things may have slowed south of Baghdad, with the 173rd jumping into the north AND with fresh feet on the ground they have a VERY good strategy in place.

Like most peaceniks, you would like nothing more that to marginalize some smart military moves and common procedures and declare this war a failure in a week. I'm sorry, but if you've effectively overran 75% of a country in 7 days... I don't know how you slice it, it's NOT a bad campaign.

It's not a matter of 'convincing' anyone of anything. It's a matter of a brutal asshole who slaughters his own people being deposed. If you lived in a society where things are as repressed as that one is for SO long.. you grow accustomed to it, whether you like it or not.

It's also a matter of this guy violating the UN sanctions imposed on him and finally bringing the hammer down on him. He dicked around long enough.

I'm sure you're one of those people that thinks because the Iraqis haven't come running into american soldiers and surrendering en masse that they love Saddam. One thing is they still remember the last time we were there and we just pulled out and let a lot of people die. They aren't easily convinced now.

They don't like Saddam, but they also don't want the US running the country because of how "evil" that the Middle East thinks we are. That's the reason why there is more resistance this time. LAst time was just booting them from Kuwait.. now it's a battle for their homes which they think they might lose. It stirs a different emotion.


If you think this war is so unjust, why not go get some archival footage of what Saddam did to the Kurds in the late '80s and the Shia revolt in '92... then tell me that this guy shouldn't be ousted. He's a fucking scumbag and while we (the US/UK) might not be the saints of this world, somebody needs to step up to the plate and do something about it. I'm proud that our countries have decided that even against public opinion in some cases (not an issue anymore.. the polls show support), they needed to do the 'right' thing.

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My comments above are being echoed by military annalists worldwide.
It is clearly an admission that the war has not gone exactly to script.
You are the one talking about guilt! Not me, I didnt use that phrase.
Why is that?
You are the one desperately trying to dismiss the deployment of another 120,000 Troops (They just announced the revised figure on TV) as all part of the plan!
Is that why GW is having to go to congress cap-in-hand for more billions? I guess that was all part of the plan was it?
Umm, 75 wasn't it?

As for US/UK popularity amongst the average innocent Iraqi civilian! lol
You need only watch the TV and listen to the news reports to see the anger, lack of trust, and the fact that there are plenty of people taking pot-shots at our troops even in areas thought secured.

And sadly, like most war-mongers, you fall into the trap of seeing any contrary point of view to yours as some kind of tacit approval of Saddam Hussein.
My but you do have a narrow view dont you?

Just heard some quote from some high ranking US officer, it'll doubtless be on your TV tonight.
Paraphrased it went something like:

'The Iraqis are not fighting like we had wargamed. We expected them to fight, but NOT LIKE THIS'

Still I guess all those re-inforcements would have been on their way anyway, right?

Those reinforcements were already on standby in the case that something like this would happen, same as in any war. We've got to put foot to ass and we will.

Metal Slug:
My comments above are being echoed by military annalists worldwide.
It is clearly an admission that the war has not gone exactly to script.
You are the one talking about guilt! Not me, I didnt use that phrase.
Why is that?
You are the one desperately trying to dismiss the deployment of another 120,000 Troops (They just announced the revised figure on TV) as all part of the plan!
Is that why GW is having to go to congress cap-in-hand for more billions? I guess that was all part of the plan was it?
Umm, 75 wasn't it?

As for US/UK popularity amongst the average innocent Iraqi civilian! lol
You need only watch the TV and listen to the news reports to see the anger, lack of trust, and the fact that there are plenty of people taking pot-shots at our troops even in areas thought secured.

And sadly, like most war-mongers, you fall into the trap of seeing any contrary point of view to yours as some kind of tacit approval of Saddam Hussein.
My but you do have a narrow view dont you?

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You implied that the US is guilty of not being able to carry out their plan. That's what I meant.. don't try to read into it.. there's nothing there.

I'm not desperate to validate my government, on the contrary, I'm quite critical of it most of the time. I don't hate it, I just ask informed questions of why things are they way they are.

Yeah, there's always going to be resistance no matter WHERE you go. Until you can read people's minds, you have to live with the fact that the enemy will sometimes be mixing in with the civilians. I don't take that as anything other than resistance by people who are supporting their government.

I'm no war-monger, as much as you'd like me to be. I don't know anyone who WANTS to go to war. Hell, I was against it for a while. It's the right thing to do, plain and simple. It really is. I hate the fact that people are dying over there and that this country is divided over it. Innocent people caught up in a system on both sides are going to die. That country is going to be wrecked in a lot of ways. It's not a pretty picture. I also wish there was a peaceful way to have settled this. There wasn't. I only hope that it's over quickly.. the US wins and the world is a safer place.

What saddens me is people like you who seem to think that anything done that you can't conceptualize or understand about the military will try to turn it into validation of your agenda.

You can hug the trees all you want, but don't call yourself a military expert when I seriously doubt you have an education in military strategy and tactics.

To play devil's advocate.. maybe you're right that they going away from the script.. there's no debating the fact that thus far you can't call this war anything but a sweeping success. They've killed 50 people, taken down maybe 5 aircraft, control *maybe* 25-35% of their country and have 7 POWS. They're adopting a guerilla tactic of annoyance, conservation of force and small squad assaults. While this is a solid strategy in some cases, this will not work in this area as they lack some key elements of a successful guerilla campaign.

Face it.. if you go by your assumption of it not going by the script.. there's no doubt they're still routing the Iraqi military. It may not be won tomorrow, though.

As much as I'm sure the anti-americans out there would love for the US to lose this war, it isn't going to happen.

MegaDrive 20XX:
Those reinforcements were already on standby in the case that something like this would happen, same as in any war. We've got to put foot to ass and we will.

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For some reason, this just sounds really funny.
Especially with the emoticon you selected for the message header.

VanillaThunder:
You can hug the trees all you want, but don't call yourself a military expert when I seriously doubt you have an education in military strategy and tactics.

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This is another funny line. The pro-war peeps are the only experts here.

Especially compared to the anti-war peeps who aren't even claiming to be experts, just common sense, and consideration to a broader world audience.

There are just so many couch-commandos with intensive CNN training... Much more deadly than the Al-Qaeda, for sure.

EvilWasabi:

VanillaThunder:
You can hug the trees all you want, but don't call yourself a military expert when I seriously doubt you have an education in military strategy and tactics.

Click to expand...

This is another funny line. The pro-war peeps are the only experts here.

Especially compared to the anti-war peeps who aren't even claiming to be experts, just common sense, and consideration to a broader world audience.

There are just so many couch-commandos with intensive CNN training... Much more deadly than the Al-Qaeda, for sure.

Click to expand...

WRONG!

I have a very solid education in small-teams combat and strategy. I'm also a former law-enforcement officer.

I never said we're the only tactical experts in the world. Once again, you're trying to put words in my mouth to try to marginalize the people supporting the war. I was stating that Metal Slug had little knowledge of that. See the difference?

Common-sense and consideration when it applies to what, exactly?

<small>[ March 28, 2003, 11:06 AM: Message edited by: VanillaThunder ]</small>

The additional troops were always a part of the plan. Any opinions to the contrary, be they from military analysts or other wise, are simply misinformed.

I know people that were activated before the fighting started. They have still not been given orders to ship out, but are on active duty. That means that they are part of the plan, but their part to play has not arisen yet. They will go. Just not yet. The initial force that was deployed was never intended to be the entire force that would eventually be there. The clean up after Saddam is removed will, by default, take more troops than are currently in Iraq.

To believe that the initial deployment of troops was all that was ever going to be shipped out is just plain ignorant.

EvilWasabi:

VanillaThunder:
You can hug the trees all you want, but don't call yourself a military expert when I seriously doubt you have an education in military strategy and tactics.

Click to expand...

This is another funny line. The pro-war peeps are the only experts here.

Especially compared to the anti-war peeps who aren't even claiming to be experts, just common sense, and consideration to a broader world audience.

There are just so many couch-commandos with intensive CNN training... Much more deadly than the Al-Qaeda, for sure.

Click to expand...

Sorry to burst your bubble on this man. But I'm 24 with 13 years of extensive studies on political science, tactics, and have the training almost equivalent to that of an Army Ranger (save HALO jumps). I learned to respect and use weapons both edged and firearms from a military Brown-Boot T.I./D.I. of a father, and got my training from former Marine Recon, Army Ranger and one French Foreign Legionnaire. Sure I'm not as sharp as I once was, but I still have all the knowledge and skills. I DID try to enter into the armed forces of my country *USA BABY!* but due to several things I'm not in the armed forces.

#1.> Medication for sleeping. I can prove to be useful with all my previous knowledge, only need to use the stuff for normal sleeping. In a theatre of war it would be a nevermind because then I wouldn't be trying to sleep to be viable in the everyday bullshit society.

#2.> Even if accepted into actual military service I would not see frontline fighting due to being an "only child" (no brothers or sisters) and the red tape is too thick to get through even with both my parents consenting to the fact they know where my heart is.

Thus while I might not be over there right now in person, I AM there in spirit, I have more than one way of getting intel (not just TV) and while I do have my own issues with my nation at times, I support what they do for seeing the bigger picture having studied all of this. I hope to go to Russia soon (still saving up) where I will be given a 6 week intensive training by former Spetsnaz. You see I'm a survivalist first and a soldier second, but given the chance to do my part I WOULD, unlike some ppl. No I'm not an expert, but having been around a family as big and diverse as mine from both sides of the ideology, and having the skills of a warrior with no war to fight... I do have a viewpoint on it most would not understand. Thus do not critize what/who you don't know.

VanillaThunder:

EvilWasabi:

VanillaThunder:
You can hug the trees all you want, but don't call yourself a military expert when I seriously doubt you have an education in military strategy and tactics.

Click to expand...

This is another funny line. The pro-war peeps are the only experts here.

Especially compared to the anti-war peeps who aren't even claiming to be experts, just common sense, and consideration to a broader world audience.

There are just so many couch-commandos with intensive CNN training... Much more deadly than the Al-Qaeda, for sure.

Click to expand...

WRONG!

I have a very solid education in small-teams combat and strategy. I'm also a former law-enforcement officer.

I never said we're the only tactical experts in the world. Once again, you're trying to put words in my mouth to try to marginalize the people supporting the war. I was stating that Metal Slug had little knowledge of that. See the difference?

Common-sense and consideration when it applies to what, exactly?

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Dude, you put words into Metal Slug's mouth saying admission of guilt. Then you tried to balance it off saying "there's nothing to read into."

Are trying to look stupid?

I'm not trying to marginalize the people supporting the war. I'm only marginalizing the stupid people supporting the war. They're mcuh more dangerous than the people that can support the war with rational statements.

Here's common sense: we're going to war in Iraq, your friends and relatives are putting their lives on the line. Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Bush are ironing out deals at home for which american corporations get to go in and take over Iraq. Some senator proposes that the US (old) cell phone technology be implemented in Iraq instead of the more popular GSM technology, because it would be using the French and German tech. Put 1 and 1 together. Common sense says that this war is bullshit.

Saddam kills people?

China kills people.

Saddam has chemical weapons of mass destruction?

Israel has more.

Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990?

The US invaded Iraq in 2003.

There's no real moral backing to the war. Any moral backing you see is a facade. Look for the money and you'll find the answers.

This really is NOT NEW.

They have what.... 225000 -25000 troops there now from the US.

The originally stated 350-375000 were going to be there.

They are just sending the rest of the troops they originally stated were going to be there.

Has nothing to do with "things are not going as planned."

†B†V†

And who gives a fuck. If we have them use them. No use jacking off back home when you can give relief to the tired troops that are abroad.

Saddam kills people?

China kills people.

Saddam has chemical weapons of mass destruction?

Israel has more.

Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990?

The US invaded Iraq in 2003.

There's no real moral backing to the war. Any moral backing you see is a facade. Look for the money and you'll find the answers.

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Not to mention our own invasion of Panama in 1989 to apprehend General Norieaga, who was just making his own cut in a CIA-devised drug scheme.
One more stoolie we set up to do our bidding in a foreign land who crossed us, thus forcing us to whack him. Seems kind of Mafia-like, don't it?

Morality has nothing to do with it. Follow the money folks. Anyone else find it interesting that Halliburton, Cheney's old company, already has secured a contract to rebuild any damage Iraqi oil wells and pipelines? Wake up and smell the carefully-crafted bullshit you guys are buying into. A state of perpetual war benefits those with ties to oil/defense companies, something the resumes of those in the Bush administration is saturated with. The only real victims are the innocent civilians caught in the crossfire, be it Iraqis getting accidentally bombed, American troops on the battlefield or American citizens who bite it in future terrorist attacks by Islamic fundamentalists incensed by US military aggression.

Meanwhile, folks like Bush rattle on about moral imperatives, watching their stocks climb while in the safety of their federally-sponsored fortresses.

Yeah Loopz, the bottom line here is oil eh buddy?

It's funny how you try and act like Bush is some evil person. You really haven't the slightest fucking idea what you are talking about.

I'm curious, did you ever actively criticize Clinton at all while he was in office? Probably not given the shit that you spew out.

I thought that my sister-in-law had gone over already but found out last night that she is one that is now going. I hope this ends soon. It really hasnt been going long but I'm tried of it. Just like the last Gulf war.

This ain't gonna be over soon...
Rumsfeld just stated that Syria is helping Iraq by supplying them material...,Iran has their sources in Iraq to says rumsfeld...What I wonder about is why the Iraqis haven't deployed their airforce yet,sure it's inferior ,but it must help a bit

You know what? No one here (including me) knows shit about whats going on in Iraq. To say that the Iraqi people are cheering us or hating us is a guess, to say that Bush is doing this for the right or wrong reasons is a guess. Stop acting like you guys know better then everyone else. No matter how much Fox news, or non bias websites you get your info from, it will never be correct. EVERYONE here is just talking out of their ASS.

<small>[ March 28, 2003, 03:16 PM: Message edited by: SuperDuperSpork ]</small>

Its all in how you look at it. If I go to war it will be to kick some terrorist or tirant ass and to help the innocent rebuild. I will be going to represent freedom, those lost in New York , my beliefs, and my family. I wont be going to war for our governments profit.

I'm really confused.

Since we haven't won this war in less than a week, it's not going as planned? Excuse me?!

Don't you realize we are slaughtering Iraqi troops! They don't stand a chance!

I was reading our local paper today (teh KC Star), and some of the Iraqi groups have been resorting to suicide charges!

They don't stand a chance, and I'm really tired of hearing this "we're losing yadayadaya" garbage

Metal Slug:
'The Iraqis are not fighting like we had wargamed. We expected them to fight, but NOT LIKE THIS'

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you have taken that quote way out of context

what they mean is that the irregulars are fighting the war in an unconventional style

basically guerilla warfare, using normal people as shields, threatening locals that they will be shot if they dont run infront of them

the iragi's cannot fight a straight fight in the desert as they will be pulverised by the howitzer and aircraft just like in 1991

heck if they send enough out we may even see a daisycutter or a moab in action buttrock buttrock

wrt to other troops being sent in - always was going to happen, you cannot sustain a level that is ongoing without back up troops to relieve each other, modern warfare my friend

<small>[ March 28, 2003, 03:54 PM: Message edited by: buster_broon ]</small>

SuperDuperSpork:
You know what? No one here (including me) knows shit about whats going on in Iraq. To say that the Iraqi people are cheering us or hating us is a guess, to say that Bush is doing this for the right or wrong reasons is a guess. Stop acting like you guys know better then everyone else. No matter how much Fox news, or non bias websites you get your info from, it will never be correct. EVERYONE here is just talking out of their ASS.

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erm check my profile

and to edit my previous post, once everything is done and dusted, you will have to have troops on peace keeping duties so they can re-build iraq and hopefully restore the beauty that was there just with a better government

buster_broon:

SuperDuperSpork:
You know what? No one here (including me) knows shit about whats going on in Iraq. To say that the Iraqi people are cheering us or hating us is a guess, to say that Bush is doing this for the right or wrong reasons is a guess. Stop acting like you guys know better then everyone else. No matter how much Fox news, or non bias websites you get your info from, it will never be correct. EVERYONE here is just talking out of their ASS.

Click to expand...

erm check my profile

and to edit my previous post, once everything is done and dusted, you will have to have troops on peace keeping duties so they can re-build iraq and hopefully restore the beauty that was there just with a better government

Click to expand...

Ok good point, not including you or anyone else directly involved.