My neo s video mod has zero interference

Is this typical? Mine has no scanlines running on solid colors. I used a stock transistor off a dead 4 slot board and did my mod with that. There is no interference at all. 220 uf cap also, not 470. It seriously looks like my neo cd's s video in terms of quality, its amazing.

I trust this was done with a CXA1145, right? Theoretically it's easily possible to have clean S-Video. You can get away with 220uf caps instead of 470 and those transistors are probably still good. Your previous mods were probably done incorrectly if there was interference, like poorly shielded components and signal cables.

But... No "scanlines"? Hmm, is this on an LCD or Plasma display?

nope, wega crt. I did heat shrink tube exposed wiring.

What scanlines on solid colors are you referring to?

I've heard that some newer SD wegas will only do 480i, no 240p.

edit: do you see combing when things scroll left or right?

mesmer said:

I've heard that some newer SD wegas will only do 480i, no 240p.

edit: do you see combing when things scroll left or right?

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How so? And why wouldnt you see scanlines on a 480i display?? I can see them on my CRT projector even on 1920x1080.

LWK said:

nope, wega crt. I did heat shrink tube exposed wiring.

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Heat shrink does nothing at all for electrical interference shielding, you need to use something metalic that will allow magnetic flux to follow it instead of cutting through the conductors.

The HD-CRT Trinitrons take 240p, through the RGB. However they see 240p as 480i via Component and attempt to deinterlace it, causing some weird effects.
But they can only display in Progressive Scan (480p and up) or 4X Zoom mode. So 240p and 480i signals are zoomed x4, and hence you lose the scanlines. Still a great looking set if you use the RGB. And the 720p mode with an X360 looks fantastic.

I still can't recommend HD crts over a standard CRT with at lease S-video.

ALL HDTVs whether it is plasma, LCD, or CRT still have to scale (except a few multi-sync monitors but those are rare).

Consequently this means line doubling, sonys digital reality creation(DRC), or other wizardly methods which all cause input lag.

These sets may fool you into thinking that they are displaying in 480p, but most are displaying in 1080i.

Would be awesome to have a decent sized multi-sync monitor other than the very expensive NEC and arcades ones. Manufacturers should've went multisync, but alas we got shitty line doubling and upscaling.

We need CRTs back!

TTIWWP

SuperDeadite said:

The HD-CRT Trinitrons take 240p, through the RGB. However they see 240p as 480i via Component and attempt to deinterlace it, causing some weird effects.
But they can only display in Progressive Scan (480p and up) or 4X Zoom mode. So 240p and 480i signals are zoomed x4, and hence you lose the scanlines. Still a great looking set if you use the RGB. And the 720p mode with an X360 looks fantastic.

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Arrr i see, my Faroudja scaler does the same thing with 240p, so it comes up fine for a couple seconds, then rolls down the screen, splits in half, then repeats that. You should certainly still see scanlines at 480p though.

ChuChu Flamingo said:

Would be awesome to have a decent sized multi-sync monitor other than the very expensive NEC and arcades ones. Manufacturers should've went multisync, but alas we got shitty line doubling and upscaling.

We need CRTs back!

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You mean like this??

When I meant Big, I meant like 25-32inches heh. Anything after that you are starting to lose quality.

Whats the input lag on that?

There is zero input lag, it is RGB-HV. Why would there be input lag??

I have never seen a high bandwidth analog input on an analog CRT projector with any input lag. You get out exactly what you put in, just like any other CRT with a straight RGB input path.

So you haven't done a time test then to verify then?

There is always input lag even with CRT, but it is in ns, not ms. I am just curious if there is lag.

Well essentially, this should be no different to any other CRT, cause it is a CRT. Its 3 tubes, same as inside a rear projection CRT TV, but the tubes are much longer to give greater brightness, they are electro-magnetic focus to give far superior sharpness and astigmatism control, and they are smooth surface phosphor so there is no shaddow mask, and no lines. What goes in, is what comes out, there is no molestation of the pure RGB signal.

Why would i bother to measure nano seconds of lag!!! No one will ever see that.

SuperDeadite said:

The HD-CRT Trinitrons take 240p, through the RGB. However they see 240p as 480i via Component and attempt to deinterlace it, causing some weird effects.
But they can only display in Progressive Scan (480p and up) or 4X Zoom mode. So 240p and 480i signals are zoomed x4, and hence you lose the scanlines. Still a great looking set if you use the RGB. And the 720p mode with an X360 looks fantastic.

Click to expand...

This is why I am actually happy with my 36" Toshiba HD-CRT made in 2002. Its native resolutions are 480p and 1080i. When it changes between those two resolution modes, the TV set makes a click sound and resets the picture resolution. When using 240p, I think with 480i and no doubt with 480p, it stays in 480p mode. It only uses 1080i mode for a 1080i signal and maybe with 480i. I haven't really tested if it clicks to different resolutions with 480i. I really like that I have scanlines that are 2x smaller with low res game systems. It is just enough to have the scanline feel and you get a smooth slight boost in resolution.

It is not the greatest set for Blu-ray and HD gaming though, but does everything else how I like it (HD-Cable looks just fine). I fixed the red-push it had by adjusting the color cut-off and color-drive settings in the service mode so that the blacks don't have a red/brown like hue.

The set does reveal the imperfections of composite/S-video interference a little, but I just turn the sharpness down and still looks damn good overall. When using a Neo Geo CDZ or Sega Saturn, I get no interference at all with S-video. With the SNES, modded Turbo-Duo/Genesis, Dreamcast, PS1 and other older consoles I do to different degrees. It even reduces shimmering and color bleeding a bit from the NES hooked up with composite video. So I can push the colors a bit more without bleeding thanks to the color/sync filter built in.

Taking a guess, but overall I would assume that a Sony 480p only Trinitron (EDTV I believe) set would most likely be the best for retrogaming from 240p to 480p.

CRTs dont have a native resolution, that is a term refering to the maximum full screen resolving ability of a fixed pixel display, which CRT is not. There is never ever 2 native resolutions on any display, and the ability to display a particular resolution is one thing, the ability to "resolve" it is quite another.

There is no 480p over composite or s-video, 480p @60Hz is 31kHz, and max for composite and s-video is 15.75kHz. Do you mean this set internally upscales the 15.75kHz signals??

What bandwidth inputs does it have?? Youll never get 1080i on anything less than component video. This thing should be awesome on 1080i for bluray!! It should EASILY resolve that.

I remember the good old days when people used to talk about video displays in lines and not pixels.

NEO-GEO man said:

CRTs dont have a native resolution, that is a term refering to the maximum full screen resolving ability of a fixed pixel display, which CRT is not. There is never ever 2 native resolutions on any display, and the ability to display a particular resolution is one thing, the ability to "resolve" it is quite another.

There is no 480p over composite or s-video, 480p @60Hz is 31kHz, and max for composite and s-video is 15.75kHz. Do you mean this set internally upscales the 15.75kHz signals??

What bandwidth inputs does it have?? Youll never get 1080i on anything less than component video. This thing should be awesome on 1080i for bluray!! It should EASILY resolve that.

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Being an HD-CRT, I assume he does have Component. Being in Japan mine has 2 D-Terminal sockets (D4 750p). And my set does display in true 480p, it's a 4:3 set lol. For 750p and 1125i, it letterboxes itself. Again it's not the greatest, but it's a good solid middle ground for me. I really see no purpose for 1125p unless you want a gigantic set. And I see no point in owning such a thing.

Yes mate i remember those days!! Werent they so much easier!! Now that digital has been forced upon us, any new display can only resolve one resolution and anything else is either not full screen or its interpolated... Ive seen analog monitors that will resolve 2,000 TVL... God bless electro-magnetic focus CRTs....

SuperDeadite said:

Being an HD-CRT, I assume he does have Component. Being in Japan mine has 2 D-Terminal sockets (D4 750p). And my set does display in true 480p, it's a 4:3 set lol. For 750p and 1125i, it letterboxes itself. Again it's not the greatest, but it's a good solid middle ground for me. I really see no purpose for 1125p unless you want a gigantic set. And I see no point in owning such a thing.

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What the hell is all this about!! I know itll have either component or RGB, it cant be a HD set without it!! I want to know which one he is using!!

Im not concerned with what you see point in, i have a 120 inch screen, and it will resolve 1200 TV lines in progressive scan with WAY more using an interlaced res, but 1125p? what the hell is that?? Never heard of such a resolution....

If i go with 1920x1080 i CAN see the scan lines from 4 meters away, the sharpness of electro-magnetic CRT is something FAR beyond what you will ever see with electro-static focus... Good electro-static focus is comparable to common digital, electro-magnetic focus CRT is mind blowing....

NEO-GEO man said:

CRTs dont have a native resolution, that is a term refering to the maximum full screen resolving ability of a fixed pixel display, which CRT is not. There is never ever 2 native resolutions on any display, and the ability to display a particular resolution is one thing, the ability to "resolve" it is quite another.

There is no 480p over composite or s-video, 480p @60Hz is 31kHz, and max for composite and s-video is 15.75kHz. Do you mean this set internally upscales the 15.75kHz signals??

What bandwidth inputs does it have?? Youll never get 1080i on anything less than component video. This thing should be awesome on 1080i for bluray!! It should EASILY resolve that.

Click to expand...

I know the CRT tube itself has no native resolution. I am talking about how the IDSC II chip in it displays just those 2 resolutions (It doesn't make things ugly like the Sony FD series with DRC 4x-ing the picture so to speak). I finally read into it more. It basically takes 240p, 480i/p and displays it in 480p with line doubling. There is no noticeable lag in the conversion at all when playing games. 480p input is slightly processed for stabilizing and 1080i input is a straight pass-through displayed in its original picture without any conversion. Blu-ray does look damn good on it, don't get me wrong. It just doesn't look as good as newer LCD-LEDs in 1080p. CRTs will always have a problem with high contrast of whites blooming a little, which takes away a bit of the sharpness.

...and yes it uses component video, its a HD set. This is the only way I can get direct 480p and 1080i input. I use component for my PS2, GC, Xbox, Neo Geo AES, 360, PS3 and my Comcast cable tv in HD. Everything else like SNES, Saturn, Dreamcast, etc.. I use S-video. I use composite for my NES and VCR since that is all they can do. The set uses the 3D Y/C comb filtering for composite and S-video. It use DNR for RF only to get rid of snow, which I never use RF ever. It even has a 3:2 pull-down for cinema mode and syncs with 24 FPS for movies.

Here in Japan HD TV via Satelite has been around for a long time. The Japanese system is 750p, 1125i, and 1125p. Now that the world has caught up, Japan has adopted the world standards of 720 and 1080, but the X360 still labels my TV's modes as 750 and 1125. Though there is virtually no difference between 720 and 750 or 1080 and 1125 by human eye standard. Pretty much the same thing really.

SuperDeadite said:

Here in Japan HD TV via Satelite has been around for a long time. The Japanese system is 750p, 1125i, and 1125p. Now that the world has caught up, Japan has adopted the world standards of 720 and 1080, but the X360 still labels my TV's modes as 750 and 1125. Though there is virtually no difference between 720 and 750 or 1080 and 1125 by human eye standard. Pretty much the same thing really.

Click to expand...

Oh i see!! Never knew what standards they used in Japan. Thanks


Ok, ill answer this in parts...

SNKNostalgia said:

CRTs will always have a problem with high contrast of whites blooming a little, which takes away a bit of the sharpness.

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Certainly not true at all. My NEC does not have any blooming what so ever, even at 100 contrast, which is too bright to watch. Sharpness and picture stability / consistency on an electro-static focusing set is nothing compared to an electro-magnetic focusing set, which i dont know if yours will be electro-magnetic or not, id have to see what is on the tube neck. I have an LG CRT monitor that is electro-magnetic focus, and it also has zero blooming, and is still razor sharp even at 1920x1440p.

SNKNostalgia said:

I know the CRT tube itself has no native resolution. I am talking about how the IDSC II chip in it displays just those 2 resolutions

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I understand what youre saying here now, but this is not a native resolution as such. Native resolution is the maximum resolution the display can resolve, or display full screen dot for dot. But still, the term Native res is grossly misused these days too.


Do a search for the Barco Reality 909 and the 912 CRTs... Both will still EASILY outdo even the best digital on the market in almost all aspects. Its just a real shame they dont still make them, and i think even VDC in Florida has temporarily stopped production of the 9500 ULTRA, which isnt as good as the Barco, but its way up there ubove anything digital in the same price range.

When you talk CRTs, there is alot of hard core stuff out there that is not at all expensive now, but was prohibitively so back when you bought your set.