New Draft of Market Rules [now officially posted]

aria · Jan 22, 2008

[highlight][NOTE (5/18/08): This thread is no longer active for changing forum rules. Please post suggestions in the new thread, here.][/highlight]

[highlight][NOTE: This is a working draft of what will be official market rules to replace the current ramshackle Market rules thread][/highlight]

Bibliophile and I have worked on a new, easier-to-follow set of market rules. These basically take everything that was spread out and puts it into one document that will hopefully make it easier for new people to follow and allow better enforcement.

This came up after the discussion in this suggestions thread (starting post #24).

So take a look at the new rules below; though, please keep in mind: "public comment" does not equate to "must change to meet suggestions".

--------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------

The Neo-Geo.com Market Forum Rules
Thank you for your interest in participating in the Market forums. Before you proceed, please read and adhere to the following rules and requirements.

1. General Provisions

1.1. By choosing to do business on these Market forums (“forums”), members of these forums (“user”) are willfully consenting to the rules stated in this post (“document”).

1.2. All transactions and interactions on these forums are governed by the rules set forth in this document.

1.3. These rules are subject to enforcement by the Moderators and Administrators of the Neo-Geo.com forums. Enforcement will be on a case-by-case basis. Decisions on how rules will be enforced or interpreted, and/or any associated punishment, is left to the discretion of the Moderators and Administrators.

2. Seller Requirements

2.1. A seller is any user who sells items of any kind on the forums.

2.2. Any user who wants to sell or trade through the forums shall meet the following requirements: they shall have been a member for at least one month and/or have a post count of at least 100 posts. Any user attempting to take advantage of the non-Market forums to meet these requirements will be subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

2.3. Sellers with insufficient (little or no) feedback and/or posts may be asked to ship items first (ship items before payment is sent), or allow local pickup. Sellers with insufficient feedback and/or posts who refuse to ship first or to allow local pickup can be identified as scammers by forum members, and will be subject to deletion or banning by the Moderators and Administrators. An example of the situation may be found here: http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171696.

2.4. Users who commit scams using the forums may have their account restricted or deleted by the Moderators and Administrators. Offending accounts may be marked with reference to the transaction.

2.4.1. Moderators and Administrators have the discretion to permit a probation period for the offending user to acceptably rectify the situation.

2.4.2. Any user who commits a scam on this website forfeits all privacy rights to their name, address and any other discoverable personal information until the situation has been acceptably rectified. Any such information can be posted on the forums, resulting in public availability on web search engines (e.g. Google).

2.5. Any user who commits a scam outside of the forums may be subject to having their account restricted or deleted by the Moderators and Administrators for the safety and protection of other members.

2.6. Any user who has no interest in being a member of the community should not join the forum just to sell their items. These forums are not meant to be an equivalent of eBay or Yahoo! Auctions. Any user suspected of this kind of behavior may be subject to actions by Moderators and Administrators.

3. Definition of Common Sales Terms

3.1. FS = For Sale

3.2. FT = For Trade

3.3. WTB: Want to Buy

3.4. WTT: Want to trade for

3.5. Condition scale. For SNK and Neo Geo-related items, please refer to the scale provided by the Neo Store: http://www.neostore.com/store/scale.html For other items, try to adapt the Neo Store scale to non-SNK and Neo Geo-related items. This will allow a minimum of buyer/seller/trader confusion.

4. Forums

4.1. (SNK) Neo Selling – Items permitted for sale include any SNK released game for the Arcade (including PCBs and complete cabinets), Neo Geo AES/NGH (home cartridge), Neo Geo MVS (arcade cartridge), Neo Geo CD, Neo Geo Hyper 64, Neo Geo Pocket (B&W or Color), the various ports to other Systems SNK released (e.g. Twinkle Star Sprites for the DC, Guerilla War for the NES), any SNK released hardware, third party products that works with SNK systems, and any SNK collectible such as key chains, art books, etc. Only items offered for sale (or auction) should be listed here.

4.2. (SNK) Neo Wanted – This forum is an opportunity for users to post wanted (to buy or trade) requests for items that qualify under the (SNK) Neo Selling forum. Such want ads or trade lists should NOT be associated with items listed for sale in another forum.

4.3. Everything Else - Buy/sell/trade any items not listed in the (SNK) Neo forums; not limited to video games.

4.4. Feedback Forum – This forum allows users to note whether they had a good or bad experience with a seller or buyer and want to notify others about the experience. Abuse of this forum is subject to action by Moderators and Administrators. See § 7.1.2.

5. Items that may NOT be sold through the forums

5.1. Any item that violates established intellectual property rights, including copyright, trademark or patent, is prohibited and subject to immediate removal by Moderators and Administrators. These include, but are not limited to:

5.1.1. “Bootleg” versions of games, including but not limited to those on MVS.

5.1.2. Any home-copied versions of games, including but not limited those burned onto CD-R.

5.2. Conversions of games from one format to another may not be sold, including but not limited to MVS games converted into an AES cartridge

5.3. Sales of the copies of artwork / manuals are prohibited. If you are going to sell photocopies of artwork or manuals, they may not be sold in the forum. You may only list them in the forum if you are giving them away for free (not making a profit on them).

6. Additional Forum Rules

6.1. The location field of a user’s profile should CORRECTLY identify where the user is located. Users in the United States, its Territories or Canada should provide City and State/Province. Users located outside of the US, its Territories or Canada should provide City and Country.

6.2. Market forums are for buying, selling, and trading only. They are not for extraneous discussion. Please post outside discussions in the proper forum outside of the Market forums.

6.3. Within the Market forums, threads regarding good or bad experiences with a seller or buyer should be posted in the Feedback Forum.

6.4. Sales threads should not be “bumped” (posted in by the seller to move to the top of the forum) for 24 hours. This includes having someone else bump one’s thread. The only exception is for update indicating that something is no longer for sale or available.

6.5. No user may have more than one current thread in each of the three sales-related Market forums (SNK Selling, SNK Wanted, Everything Else). If a user has multiple items for sale (or that they want to buy or trade), they should list them all in one thread.

6.6. If all items listed in a sales thread are sold (or that are wanted have been bought), please update that thread to let other users know.

6.7. There is to be no “poisoning” of other users sales threads, e.g.: if a seller is selling something for $100, posting that the same item is available eBay for $70 would be considered “poisoning” the thread. These forums operate under the view that it is each buyer’s responsibility to research the fair market price for an item.

6.7.1. There is only an exception if the seller has been identified as a scammer.

6.8. Do not disrupt another seller’s thread unless the seller has been identified as a scammer.

6.9. Selling threads regarding auctions should be identified as such in the title.

6.10. The titles for all threads should clearly state what is for sale, wanted or trade. Vague and/or misleading titles are subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

6.11. Only list items for sale that are actually in your possession. Do not list items that are for a friend or other third party unless the item is actually in your possession.

6.12. If you are advertising auctions on other websites (e.g. eBay), please refrain from selling the item on these forums and closing those auctions early.

6.13. Whenever possible, please post photos of your items for sale. Please comply with requests to provide photos of items. New and/or suspicious users may be asked to post a photo of the item with a piece of paper showing the date the photo was taken. This may be requested as evidence that a user actually possesses the item. Refusing to post a photo when requested may result in users reporting the offender as a scammer and action by Moderators and Administrators.

6.14. Users should ALWAYS describe the condition of boxes, manuals, discs, carts, etc. Be sure to note if the items being sold are complete, loose, has manual, back cover, etc. Deception is not tolerated; e.g., if a listing has photos of the front of a cartridge, but there is a Blockbuster sticker on the back, it should be clearly noted in the description.

6.15. Users must list their shipping methods. If using media mail, buyers should be informed before they agree to complete the transaction.

6.16. Always ship using some method of tracking. When using UPS, FedEx, or DHL, tracking is almost always included. However, when using USPS (United States Postal Service), use delivery confirmation if tracking is not otherwise available. It only costs $.50 to add “delivery confirmation,” and it may prevent confusion during a transaction will help prevent a user from being labeled a scammer if the item is “lost in the mail.”

6.17. Sellers should list forms of acceptable payment. Note: Most users on this site use PayPal, thus sellers should make it clear if they do not accept PayPal. Sellers should note if they accept money orders, cash, and checks. It is acceptable to wait for personal checks to clear.

7. Feedback

7.1. Feedback left in the forums may only be left for transactions conducted through the forums. This means that there must be a thread in the Market forums which provided the basis of the transaction. There are two exceptions:

7.1.1. Transactions occurring outside of the forums that include a thread in the Market forums. For example: if a person sells an item on eBay, feedback should be left for that transaction on eBay, not in these forums. However, if a person lists an item for sale on eBay and this forum, then feedback may be left for the transaction in both eBay and this forum.

7.1.2. Any scam, anywhere by anyone, may be reported in our Feedback Forum as a warning to users in the Community.

7.2. When leaving feedback, one must list the thread that served as the basis of the transaction.

DangerousK · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak, one thing I would recommend is that anyone who scams someone is subject to getting a custom rank as well as a link under the rank to the deal in question.

aria · Jan 22, 2008

DangerousK said:
Bobak, one thing I would recommend is that anyone who scams someone is subject to getting a custom rank as well as a link under the rank to the deal in question.

While I think that might be included within § 1.3, I don't think it would hurt to state it explicitly. I'll add it.

Bibliophile · Jan 22, 2008

The only thing I would add is that I think we should prohibit smut/porn/adult materials from being sold through the market forums. Here is an example of such a thread:

http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176785

It is not that I am on an all-out crusade against adult materials. But there are so many places on the internet to buy and sell smut that if members want to buy and sell it, they can find so many other sites to do so. I mean, do we really want Neo-Geo.com to become your source for smut.

Another factor to consider, not every member of this forum is over 18. Do we want parents to ban their kids from coming to Neo-geo.com because they can by smut on it? Case in point: I recently sold an AES game to a forum member who came by to pick it up in person. I didn't know it when we agree upon it, but he was under-age, so his parents brought him by. Nice family, but I can't help but wonder if his parents (who are supportive of his AES collecting) would want him on the site if he can easily get smut here too?

aria · Jan 22, 2008

Bibliophile said:
The only thing I would add is that I think we should prohibit smut/porn/adult materials from being sold through the market forums. Here is an example of such a thread:

http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176785

It is not that I am on an all-out crusade against adult materials. But there are so many places on the internet to buy and sell smut that if members want to buy and sell it, they can find so many other sites to do so. I mean, do we really want Neo-Geo.com to become your source for smut.

Another factor to consider, not every member of this forum is over 18. Do we want parents to ban their kids from coming to Neo-geo.com because they can by smut on it? Case in point: I recently sold an AES game to a forum member who came by to pick it up in person. I didn't know it when we agree upon it, but he was under-age, so his parents brought him by. Nice family, but I can't help but wonder if his parents (who are supportive of his AES collecting) would want him on the site if he can easily get smut here too?

That could open us up to a whole bunch of interpretations of "what is porn": if someone wants to sell In the Realm of the Senses or Last Tango in Paris, are they pornographic? Of course, if they straight-up label them as porn as they did in that thread its easier to identify. I'm neutral: I'm not sure if this is something we want to do since it would risk a chilling effect. Any more opinions on this?

Bibliophile · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak said:
That could open us up to a whole bunch of interpretations of "what is porn": if someone wants to sell In the Realm of the Senses or Last Tango in Paris, are they pornographic? Of course, if they straight-up label them as porn as they did in that thread its easier to identify. I'm neutral: I'm not sure if this is something we want to do since it would risk a chilling effect. Any more opinions on this?

Two points: First, I wouldn't suggest we even go into interpreting "what is porn." But if it is an item that can be easily identified as porn, smut, or "adult DVD's", I am sure that there are other places on the internet that Azathoth could find to sell them. Plus, here there is no question as to whether they are adult materials, because they have already been labeled as such.

Second, do I really think that one person selling "adult DVD's" in the forums is a big deal? No. But if we let one person post such items, then someone else will come along and think "well, if he can do it, I can, too." And then a third. And a fourth. And sooner or later we end up with the "everything else" forum half-filled with members trying to offload adult DVD's they no longer want.

qube · Jan 22, 2008

Magnaflux said:
This doesn't mean you'll be banning datalogik does it?

lol

On topic though: Thank you guys for taking the time to do this. Anything we as a site can do to help keep this community safe from fraud is a step in the right direction IMO.

Nesagwa · Jan 22, 2008

Bibliophile said:
Two points: First, I wouldn't suggest we even go into interpreting "what is porn." But if it is an item that can be easily identified as porn, smut, or "adult DVD's", I am sure that there are other places on the internet that Azathoth could find to sell them. Plus, here there is no question as to whether they are adult materials, because they have already been labeled as such.

Second, do I really think that one person selling "adult DVD's" in the forums is a big deal? No. But if we let one person post such items, then someone else will come along and think "well, if he can do it, I can, too." And then a third. And a fourth. And sooner or later we end up with the "everything else" forum half-filled with members trying to offload adult DVD's they no longer want.

Youre stepping over the line here buddy.

Step off.

channelmaniac · Jan 22, 2008

4.4. Feedback Forum – This forum allows users to note whether they had a good or bad experience with a seller or buyer and want to notify others about the experience. Abuse of this forum is subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

Hmmm... A little note here would help... the FF isn't used for just buying/selling here but also for eBay and other forums. There are plenty of posts about eBay sellers and scammers on other forums so you might want to clarify this section a bit.

Otherwise, NICE JOB!

RJ

Bibliophile · Jan 22, 2008

channelmaniac said:
4.4. Feedback Forum – This forum allows users to note whether they had a good or bad experience with a seller or buyer and want to notify others about the experience. Abuse of this forum is subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

Hmmm... A little note here would help... the FF isn't used for just buying/selling here but also for eBay and other forums. There are plenty of posts about eBay sellers and scammers on other forums so you might want to clarify this section a bit.

Otherwise, NICE JOB!

RJ

Good point, but I think that is covered under Rule 7.1.2:

7.1.2. Any scam, anywhere by anyone, may be reported in our Feedback Forum as a warning to users in the Community.

Xavier · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak said:
5.1.1. “Bootleg” versions of games, including but not limited to those on MVS.

5.2. Conversions of games from one format to another may not be sold, including but not limited to MVS games converted into an AES cartridge

Damned one day I want to buy a Ghostlop, guess I wont be able to buy it here huh?
Id guess that theres another 6+ games that never saw a general public release and the only way to play them is on emulator or conversion.
Also this means that the only metal slugs aes for sale here should be legit and $5,000+.

evil wasabi · Jan 22, 2008

I think you both did a good job.

I'm against restrictions on the sale of porn. Sometimes you want it. Sometimes you want to get rid of it.

As long as items are clearly described, no actual pictures of porn posted, and no confusion occurs, there should be no problem.

As for minors getting porn, I think that prohibiting sale of such items should be on the shoulders of the seller, not the site. Just as the site cannot be held accountable for the opinions expressed by the members, the site is not responsible for what is transacted upon these forums.

The administration should actively regulate commerce mainly to ensure that people receive what they expect - what they have paid for. If someone sells a bootleg metal slug 1 as legit, that's a problem. Bootleg carts are different from porn though, because porn will almost always be described as porn. If I told you that my copy of Rochelle, Rochelle was not porn, but a romantic drama, you wouldn't want it. If I tell you that my copy of Metal Slug is legit, you'd be willing to pay even more. That's where the problem lies in bootleg material.

That is my stance on porn. I hope you lighten your stance, Bibliophile.

I also imagine Bobak has probably never downloaded or bought porn. Like his computer has zero porn on it. My imagination is just that active.

There is another topic of protos. Some people here possess protos that were converted to home carts. Zentrick, Ghostlop, Castlevania X, Shaq Fu. Where do they stand?

talks2wall · Jan 22, 2008

Nice job guys, seems very thorough to me. As for the porn issue, I don't think there's a strong enough reason to restrict the sale of it. Besides, does anyone actually pay for porn anyway?

Along with these updates rules, should we expect any mods to keep a close(r) eye on the selling forums? I personally haven't had any problems, but there's been plenty of drama lately and rules are only good if they're enforced.

evil wasabi · Jan 22, 2008

talks2wall said:
Nice job guys, seems very thorough to me. As for the porn issue, I don't think there's a strong enough reason to restrict the sale of it. Besides, does anyone actually pay for porn anyway?

Along with these updates rules, should we expect any mods to keep a close(r) eye on the selling forums? I personally haven't had any problems, but there's been plenty of drama lately and rules are only good if they're enforced.

moderation on this site is, as you probably noticed, extremely lax. This is a philosophy that Shawn has encouraged, and it has worked very well. It's one of the reasons why this forum has lasted over 7 years, despite the death of the Neo Geo.

I check the feedback forum regularly, but most of the time, it's just people working out their problems. Nothing to get involved in. When a problem gets ugly, usually, the victim will write directly to the mods asking for an intervention. This is rare.

As I usually say, at least once a year, the moderator's job is janitorial, rather than police oriented. We're not here to manipulate or control the traffic and the conduct, but rather to just keep things tidy.

aria · Jan 22, 2008

Yes, protos are an interesting issue...

Xavier said:
Damned one day I want to buy a Ghostlop, guess I wont be able to buy it here huh?
Id guess that theres another 6+ games that never saw a general public release and the only way to play them is on emulator or conversion.
Also this means that the only metal slugs aes for sale here should be legit and $5,000+.

wasabi said:
There is another topic of protos. Some people here possess protos that were converted to home carts. Zentrick, Ghostlop, Castlevania X, Shaq Fu. Where do they stand?

While there are IP issues over protos, I doubt that's something the Community would like to see curtailed. I would rather keep the rules as is, but have a permissive (§ 1.3) stance on items like protos or similar (case-by-case). Indeed, for certain conversions it might just be best to leave it to eBay.

Thoughts?

channelmaniac · Jan 22, 2008

Bibliophile said:
Good point, but I think that is covered under Rule 7.1.2:

7.1.2. Any scam, anywhere by anyone, may be reported in our Feedback Forum as a warning to users in the Community.

But... my point is that yes it is covered BELOW... shouldn't it be covered above then referenced below? It's kinda out of order.

RJ

aria · Jan 22, 2008

channelmaniac said:
But... my point is that yes it is covered BELOW... shouldn't it be covered above then referenced below? It's kinda out of order.

RJ

While excessive cross-referencing can get cumbersome, I think that's a good one. I'll add a "see § 7.1.2" to § 4.4.

evil wasabi · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak said:
Yes, protos are an interesting issue...

While there are IP issues over protos, I doubt that's something the Community would like to see curtailed. I would rather keep the rules as is, but have a permissive (§ 1.3) stance on items like protos or similar (case-by-case). Indeed, for certain conversions it might just be best to leave it to eBay.

Thoughts?

I was just kidding around. We can't expect to cover all the exceptions and outliers. I don't think I have seen protos for sale here explicitly. Those in the know talk to those in the know, off the boards. Then proto talk usually occurs outside the market...

Still, I'd like to get my hands on a Castlevania X proto homecart...

TonK · Jan 22, 2008

Average Joe said:
NG.com is my main source for porn, narcotics, bootleg designer clothing and Chinese babies.

SHHHHHHHH!

TonK · Jan 22, 2008

P.S.

None of that shit is going to work,

TonK · Jan 22, 2008

Also, if I don't like the numbers in a sales thread, I will "poison" it.

I'll go by my rules, thanks!

TonK · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak said:
Bibliophile and I have worked on a new, easier-to-follow set of market rules. These basically take everything that was spread out and puts it into one document that will hopefully make it easier for new people to follow and allow better enforcement.

This came up after the discussion in this suggestions thread (starting post #24).

So take a look at the new rules below; though, please keep in mind: "public comment" does not equate to "must change to meet suggestions".

--------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------

The Neo-Geo.com Market Forum Rules
Thank you for your interest in participating in the Market forums. Before you proceed, please read and adhere to the following rules and requirements.

1. General Provisions

1.1. By choosing to do business on these Market forums (“forums”), members of these forums (“user”) are willfully consenting to the rules stated in this post (“document”).

1.2. All transactions and interactions on these forums are governed by the rules set forth in this document.

1.3. These rules are subject to enforcement by the Moderators and Administrators of the Neo-Geo.com forums. Enforcement will be on a case-by-case basis. Decisions on how rules will be enforced or interpreted, and/or any associated punishment, is left to the discretion of the Moderators and Administrators.

2. Seller Requirements

2.1. A seller is any user who sells items of any kind on the forums.

2.2. Any user who wants to sell or trade through the forums shall meet the following requirements: they shall have been a member for at least three months and/or have a post count of at least 100 posts. Any user attempting to take advantage of the non-Market forums to meet these requirements will be subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

2.3. Sellers with insufficient (little or no) feedback and/or posts may be asked to ship items first (ship items before payment is sent), or allow local pickup. Sellers with insufficient feedback and/or posts who refuse to ship first or to allow local pickup can be identified as scammers by forum members, and will be subject to deletion or banning by the Moderators and Administrators. An example of the situation may be found here: http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171696.

2.4. Users who commit scams using the forums will have their account restricted or deleted by the Moderators and Administrators. Offending accounts will be marked with reference to the transaction.

2.4.1. Moderators and Administrators have the discretion to permit a probation period for the offending user to acceptably rectify the situation.

2.4.2. Any user who commits a scam on this website forfeits all privacy rights to their name, address and any other discoverable personal information until the situation has been acceptably rectified. Any such information can be posted on the forums, resulting in public availability on web search engines (e.g. Google).

2.5. Any user who commits a scam outside of the forums will be subjected to having their account restricted or deleted by the Moderators and Administrators for the safety and protection of other members.

2.6. Any user who has no interest in being a member of the community should not join the forum just to sell their items. These forums are not meant to be an equivalent of eBay or Yahoo! Auctions. Any user suspected of this kind of behavior may be subject to actions by Moderators and Administrators.

3. Definition of Common Sales Terms

3.1. FS = For Sale

3.2. FT = For Trade

3.3. WTB: Want to Buy

3.4. WTT: Want to trade for

3.5. Condition scale. For SNK and Neo Geo-related items, please refer to the scale provided by the Neo Store: http://www.neostore.com/store/scale.html For other items, try to adapt the Neo Store scale to non-SNK and Neo Geo-related items. This will allow a minimum of buyer/seller/trader confusion.

4. Forums

4.1. (SNK) Neo Selling – Items permitted for sale include any SNK released game for the Arcade (including PCBs and complete cabinets), Neo Geo AES/NGH (home cartridge), Neo Geo MVS (arcade cartridge), Neo Geo CD, Neo Geo Hyper 64, Neo Geo Pocket (B&W or Color), the various ports to other Systems SNK released (e.g. Twinkle Star Sprites for the DC, Guerilla War for the NES), any SNK released hardware, third party products that works with SNK systems, and any SNK collectible such as key chains, art books, etc. Only items offered for sale (or auction) should be listed here.

4.2. (SNK) Neo Wanted – This forum is an opportunity for users to post wanted (to buy or trade) requests for items that qualify under the (SNK) Neo Selling forum. Such want ads or trade lists should NOT be associated with items listed for sale in another forum.

4.3. Everything Else - Buy/sell/trade any items not listed in the (SNK) Neo forums; not limited to video games.

4.4. Feedback Forum – This forum allows users to note whether they had a good or bad experience with a seller or buyer and want to notify others about the experience. Abuse of this forum is subject to action by Moderators and Administrators. See § 7.1.2.

5. Items that may NOT be sold through the forums

5.1. Any item that violates established intellectual property rights, including copyright, trademark or patent, is prohibited and subject to immediate removal by Moderators and Administrators. These include, but are not limited to:

5.1.1. UP TO THE BUYER - I.E. "THRILL KILL" (MAYBE THE COST OF THE DISC) “Bootleg” versions of games, including but not limited to those on MVS.

5.1.2. UP TO THE BUYER - I.E. "SAPPHIRE" AND OTHER HIGHLY EXPENSIVE GAMES (MAYBE THE COST OF THE DISC) Any home-copied versions of games, including but not limited those burned onto CD-R.

5.2. UP TO THE BUYER - I.E. GHOSTLOP Conversions of games from one format to another may not be sold, including but not limited to MVS games converted into an AES cartridge

5.3. CUSTOM INSERTS AND STICKERS? Sales of the copies of artwork / manuals are prohibited. If you are going to sell photocopies of artwork or manuals, they may not be sold in the forum. You may only list them in the forum if you are giving them away for free (not making a profit on them).

6. Additional Forum Rules

6.1. DISAGREE The location field of a user’s profile should CORRECTLY identify where the user is located. Users in the United States, its Territories or Canada should provide City and State/Province. Users located outside of the US, its Territories or Canada should provide City and Country.

6.2. Market forums are for buying, selling, and trading only. They are not for extraneous discussion. Please post outside discussions in the proper forum outside of the Market forums.

6.3. IF I WAS SCAMMED BY A MEMBER, I WILL POST IT IN HIS/HER THREAD Within the Market forums, threads regarding good or bad experiences with a seller or buyer should be posted in the Feedback Forum.

6.4. Sales threads should not be “bumped” (posted in by the seller to move to the top of the forum) for 24 hours. This includes having someone else bump one’s thread. The only exception is for update indicating that something is no longer for sale or available.

6.5. No user may have more than one current thread in each of the three sales-related Market forums (SNK Selling, SNK Wanted, Everything Else). If a user has multiple items for sale (or that they want to buy or trade), they should list them all in one thread.

6.6. If all items listed in a sales thread are sold (or that are wanted have been bought), please update that thread to let other users know.

6.7. I SHALL CONTINUE TO POISON There is to be no “poisoning” of other users sales threads, e.g.: if a seller is selling something for $100, posting that the same item is available eBay for $70 would be considered “poisoning” the thread. These forums operate under the view that it is each buyer’s responsibility to research the fair market price for an item.

6.7.1. There is only an exception if the seller has been identified as a scammer.

6.8. I SHALL CONTINUE TO DISRUPT Do not disrupt another seller’s thread unless the seller has been identified as a scammer.

6.9. Selling threads regarding auctions should be identified as such in the title.

6.10. NEED AN EXAMPLE The titles for all threads should clearly state what is for sale, wanted or trade. Vague and/or misleading titles are subject to action by Moderators and Administrators.

6.11. YEAH, THIS IS GOING TO WORK Only list items for sale that are actually in your possession. Do not list items that are for a friend or other third party unless the item is actually in your possession.

6.12. SO IF SOMEONE HERE OFFERS ME A SUM OF MONEY I CAN'T END THE AUCTION? If you are advertising auctions on other websites (e.g. eBay), please refrain from selling the item on these forums and closing those auctions early.

6.13. Whenever possible, please post photos of your items for sale. Please comply with requests to provide photos of items. New and/or suspicious users may be asked to post a photo of the item with a piece of paper showing the date the photo was taken. This may be requested as evidence that a user actually possesses the item. Refusing to post a photo when requested may result in users reporting the offender as a scammer and action by Moderators and Administrators.

6.14. Users should ALWAYS describe the condition of boxes, manuals, discs, carts, etc. Be sure to note if the items being sold are complete, loose, has manual, back cover, etc. Deception is not tolerated; e.g., if a listing has photos of the front of a cartridge, but there is a Blockbuster sticker on the back, it should be clearly noted in the description.

6.15. Users must list their shipping methods. If using media mail, buyers should be informed before they agree to complete the transaction.

6.16. Always ship using some method of tracking. When using UPS, FedEx, or DHL, tracking is almost always included. However, when using USPS (United States Postal Service), use delivery confirmation if tracking is not otherwise available. It only costs $.50 to add “delivery confirmation,” and it may prevent confusion during a transaction will help prevent a user from being labeled a scammer if the item is “lost in the mail.”

6.17. Sellers should list forms of acceptable payment. Note: Most users on this site use PayPal, thus sellers should make it clear if they do not accept PayPal. Sellers should note if they accept money orders, cash, and checks. It is acceptable to wait for personal checks to clear.

7. Feedback

7.1. Feedback left in the forums may only be left for transactions conducted through the forums. This means that there must be a thread in the Market forums which provided the basis of the transaction. There are two exceptions:

7.1.1. Transactions occurring outside of the forums that include a thread in the Market forums. For example: if a person sells an item on eBay, feedback should be left for that transaction on eBay, not in these forums. However, if a person lists an item for sale on eBay and this forum, then feedback may be left for the transaction in both eBay and this forum.

7.1.2. Any scam, anywhere by anyone, may be reported in our Feedback Forum as a warning to users in the Community.

7.2. When leaving feedback, one must list the thread that served as the basis of the transaction.

Added my thoughts for now.

aria · Jan 22, 2008

TonK said:
Also, if I don't like the numbers in a sales thread, I will "poison" it.

I'll go by my rules, thanks!

Haven't you complained about poisoning before?

TonK · Jan 22, 2008

Bobak said:
Haven't you complained about poisoning before?

I don't believe I have, but feel free to prove me wrong.

I mean if it was an asinine remark, I might have.

With all I've done for the market, it would of been nice to have been asked for my input.

Bibliophile · Jan 22, 2008

TonK said:
With all I've done for the market, it would of been nice to have been asked for my input.

While I understand your concern, it wasn't my place to do so. Allow me to explain.

The responsibility I undertook was to collect and rewrite the market rules, NOT to change them. The previous market rules were scattered and piecemeal over several threads. I offered to collect them in a single document, organize them, and rewrite them in an easier to understand manner. I didn't collect anyone's input because I wasn't trying to change them.

Changing them isn't my place, or yours either. It is up to Bobak and the rest of the administrators and moderators. Believe me, if I had any say-so in the rules, one would be added for "no porn sold in the forums." But that was not my place.

Keep in mind that Bobak does care about your input and that of the other members of this forum, which is why he created this thread to begin with. Otherwise, he would have just posted them and said "obey or be banned!"

(Also, keep in mind that "care for one's input" does not mean "agree with one's input.")

I appreciate your work in the market forums. Keep up the good work.

New Draft of Market Rules [now officially posted]

Former Moderator

MotoGP and Formula 1 Freak

Former Moderator

, I liek DragonWarrior

Former Moderator

, I liek DragonWarrior

Canadian Moderator

Beard of Zeus,

Mr Neo Fix-it

, I liek DragonWarrior

Ozma War Hero

The Jongmaster

Host for Orochi

The Jongmaster

Former Moderator

Mr Neo Fix-it

Former Moderator

The Jongmaster

Least Valuable Player

Least Valuable Player

Least Valuable Player

Least Valuable Player

Former Moderator

Least Valuable Player

, I liek DragonWarrior