Out of date, need a list of what a supergun needs these days. (features)

Like the title says,

Out of date tech guy needs a list of what a supergun needs these days.

It's been a while and I am not sure what is done to the newer superguns.Just don't want to miss any cool options that newer guns have.

I did see a thread on a new type of attenuatin circuit, but have the parts for the older version, so may stick with that.

What I have in my thoughts...

Power Button
Test Button
Service button
component video
rca pause setup
Stereo/Mono switch
RCA
S-vid
Power and pause leds
way to get to the RGB pots on the encoder
DB 15's for neo pads etc..
Kick harness, cps2 style...with 3rd and 4th player suppoer.
Fan 12v

What am I missing? what's outdated? Opinions/etc wanted

what do you guys have going on these days?

Is there an internal psu that has everything? I'd like +12, +5, -5, and +3.3. Thinking of maybe adding some Naomi power connections etc. Maybe some extra covered power sockets of some type incase I need to make extra adapters...

I'd like this thing to be able to cover JVS too if possible. Maybe have an internal JVS Sega I/O w/ home made adapter.

Full length jamma harness..

Maybe have a speaker or two.

Would it be possible to include a volume knob...what type of pot would I need? etc?

This will most likely be my last supergun, So I'd like to make it nice and complete with everything I'll need for some time.

thanks for your time,

-Eric

You dont really need a service button. It just adds a coin but doesnt save it to the financial data.

Only thing I see missing is the attenuated audio circuit.

If you plan to have a lot of stuff enclosed I would recommend 2 internal fans, one to suck and one to blow, better circulation in the case.

Most internal PSUs I've seen output +5v,+12v,-12v or +5v,+12v,-5v, but the really good small ones are expensive. For the 3.3v you can just use a 100ohm resistor if you're using it for the LEDs.

Also maybe add a sync cleaner just to have it.

Ya and external RGB pots are good, I prefer them in front rather than the back, just more convenient.

Thats my 2 cents.

Xian Xi said:

You dont really need a service button. It just adds a coin but doesnt save it to the financial data.

Only thing I see missing is the attenuated audio circuit.

If you plan to have a lot of stuff enclosed I would recommend 2 internal fans, one to suck and one to blow, better circulation in the case.

Most internal PSUs I've seen output +5v,+12v,-12v or +5v,+12v,-5v, but the really good small ones are expensive. For the 3.3v you can just use a 100ohm resistor if you're using it for the LEDs.

Also maybe add a sync cleaner just to have it.

Ya and external RGB pots are good, I prefer them in front rather than the back, just more convenient.

Thats my 2 cents.

Click to expand...

thanks! I did mention attenuation stuff up there, but wasn't sure if there was a better way now than the 1k 1/4w and 10k 1/4w...

My pots are already on the encoder, so it will be tough to get them external. I do like the front mounting idea. I'd be using the 3.3 for naomi purposes if needed...would that still work? and what runs into that resistor?

Sync cleaner huh..thats new to me. Very cool! Thanks! Any suggestions on a type or model?

My pots were on the encoder already as well, just desolder them and run wire from the encoder to the externals.

Xian Xi said:

My pots were on the encoder already as well, just desolder them and run wire from the encoder to the externals.

Click to expand...

ok, thanks!

NGT said:

Power Button
Test Button
Service button
component video
rca pause setup
Stereo/Mono switch
RCA
S-vid
Power and pause leds
way to get to the RGB pots on the encoder
DB 15's for neo pads etc..
Kick harness, cps2 style...with 3rd and 4th player suppoer.
Fan 12v

Click to expand...

Sounds like too many unnecessary feature to me. I'd rather keep the entry price cheap and simple for gamers. I know the purpose of this topic is all the bells and whistles you might be forgetting though.

I'd run the extra buttons to a molex or similar connector, then you can attach your kick-harnesses to that. If you ever want to play CPS1, ST-V, etc games that require more buttons it's easier than removing the connector from a dead CPS2 board to make an adapter.

For 3 & 4 player support, I'd just make an extra box--a smaller size of the project box you're using for the SG would be good--and put DB15 controller ports on that. Then have a connector on the back that you can attach to whatever you need. Cleaner that way.

Also, I'd recommend if you're doing an ATT Circuit to put in a switch to disable it. For some boards it can kill the audio all together--PGM has issues with that on my SG.

Think that's about it. If you want to get crazy, have a voltmeter built-in and a pot to adjust +5 if needed.

-Kickin' Wing

Kickin|wiNg said:

For 3 & 4 player support, I'd just make an extra box--a smaller size of the project box you're using for the SG would be good--and put DB15 controller ports on that. Then have a connector on the back that you can attach to whatever you need. Cleaner that way.

Click to expand...

Box? What for?

They look kind of fragile, but they've never failed me. Solder, hot glue and tape do the job.

Neo Alec said:

Sounds like too many unnecessary feature to me. I'd rather keep the entry price cheap and simple for gamers. I know the purpose of this topic is all the bells and whistles you might be forgetting though.

Click to expand...

I'm not selling anything. It's for me.
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Oh, and you have buy the male end of the cps2 connector online. I have a spare still in the package somewhere around here. If I can find it, I'll post the part number. I've used them in setting up a cabinet with street fighter zero 2 alpha and groove on fight dual'd together in a cab.


As for the 3rd and 4th player things, those are cool...but I'd like this to be a little less ghetto (no offense intended, as I have stuff ghetto rigged too, lol)

NGT said:

As for the 3rd and 4th player things, those are cool...but I'd like this to be a little less ghetto (no offense intended, as I have stuff ghetto rigged too, lol)

Click to expand...

None taken. I pride myself in having functional, but ghetto setups. I like to get by cheap, because I'm not trying to impress anyone with my setups, just the games I play. If someone does build a gun with 3&4-player ports built-in, please show us how it turns out.

I actually would put the test and service buttons on the supergun -- I'm seeming to remember that Atomiswave menus are navigated entirely by the test and service buttons, and controllers do not work in it, so with one and not the other, you may not be able to configure all boards. I know the Naomi works like this too but it has a test/service button on the motherboard so you can work around it. It's only one additional switch -- for my money, I'd rather spend $2 now than disassemble later.

Jeff Kurtz's encoder that I bought came with permanently mounted resistors, I removed them for pots for RGB level.

I created a 10:1 audio reduction circuit (basically a voltage divider) as you mentioned with a 10k and 1k resistor. I also recommend a bypass. It's been said that 3rd generation Cave games hate the attenuation circuit, so I put a switch in to defeat it, and experienced it a bit with a Mushihime-Tama board.

I put in a Stereo/Mono switch of the MVS variety. I use it in Stereo mode on MVS boards, and, so far, only Sexy Parodius. I don't think I've run across any other JAMMA games that support it yet, but my horizontal collection is not varied.

I agree too with connecting buttons 4/5/6 to a generic Molex connector and than making an adapter to CPS2/3 that connects to that, rather than dealing with soldering to a male CPS2 connector for each adapter you make. I have not found solder-cup male CPS2 connectors, only board mount, so soldering to them is very difficult.

If you are putting a power supply inside, a lighted AC power switch even easier than a LED. They have three legs, you attach the hot line to one, the neutral to a 2nd, and the load to a 3rd, and when you flip the switch, bingo, light. Also, if you're bringing AC in, fuse the inbound AC line for safety.

I prefer a JAMMA PSU inside the case rather than external supplies. A bit neater, but cooling is a very good idea.

If you're going to run a JVS board on your supergun, you're most likely to run a Naomi with a Capcom power supply, which automatically creates 3.3V from the 5V line. Consider whether you'll really ever want to run something that needs 3.3V natively. For example, if you run the Naomi off a internal 3.3V supply, then you'll still need a external JAMMA I/O, you'll need to connect the audio to the Naomi mobo instead of the supergun (because there is no audio amp), etc. So that extra 3.3v internal, in my opinion, doesn't net you anything in the long run.

I *believe* JK's Neobitz has a sync cleaner on board in it's latest revision, you simply remove the switch and wire it out to the case.

I did a aux audio in, switchable so the audio going out through the switchable attenuation circuit can come from either JAMMA or the aux. Mainly built it for the Stereo Atomiswave output not being on the JAMMA connector, only on an Aux, and never used it because I've never made a harness. I think I've seen Stereo out aux connectors on a few boards, such as Seibu, but have yet to utilize it.

danox574 said:

I created a 10:1 audio reduction circuit (basically a voltage divider) as you mentioned with a 10k and 1k resistor. I also recommend a bypass. It's been said that 3rd generation Cave games hate the attenuation circuit, so I put a switch in to defeat it, and experienced it a bit with a Mushihime-Tama board.

Click to expand...

I don't understand why you would want to reduce the audio level by that much. Just turn down the knob on the board. I'm still not sold on attenuation circuits. I've yet to be shown why they're necessary.

danox574 said:

I did a aux audio in, switchable so the audio going out through the switchable attenuation circuit can come from either JAMMA or the aux. Mainly built it for the Stereo Atomiswave output not being on the JAMMA connector, only on an Aux, and never used it because I've never made a harness. I think I've seen Stereo out aux connectors on a few boards, such as Seibu, but have yet to utilize it.

Click to expand...

What kind of connector does the Atomiswave use? I've never seen one in person, so I just kind of assumed it was on the jamma pins when people mentioned the stereo sound.

The stereo Konami boards all have an auxiliary audio connector, so that's the one I have wiring for (it's just a stereo RCA wire with the correct 4-pin molex connector wired to the end). I also have one for Data East boards (similar but larger molex connector). If a game has stereo sound, I never want to miss out on it.

Since the types of connectors vary so much, I wouldn't dream of actually building the audio harnesses into the supergun. I just make the wires for the games I need. Same goes for the 3&4p wiring -- I mostly have boards with the Konami/Taito/Data East connectors, but there are exceptions like my Karate Blazers board (uses two jamma connectors instead) and my Hook board (proprietary connectors).

You have to think about at what point does the supergun wiring make life easier, and when is it just making things more complicated?

thanks for the thoughts Good ideas all around! Soaking it all up and complicated is ok, as long as it's done right and serves a purpose.

danox574 said:

I actually would put the test and service buttons on the supergun -- I'm seeming to remember that Atomiswave menus are navigated entirely by the test and service buttons, and controllers do not work in it, so with one and not the other, you may not be able to configure all boards.

Click to expand...

You can actually use the 1P Start button to navigate the Menu on Atomiswave for games that don't support the joystick. Tap for next selection, Hold to change current selection.

-Kickin' Wing

Neo Alec said:

I don't understand why you would want to reduce the audio level by that much. Just turn down the knob on the board. I'm still not sold on attenuation circuits. I've yet to be shown why they're necessary.

Click to expand...

They aren't necessary. It's just nice to not have to grab your board and make sure that the volume is bottomed out whenever you pick it up to fire it up, because if the volume is blazing, you can get some wicked loud distortion from your stereo or TV. To the layman like me, it sounds dangerous potentially. A 10:1 ratio was originally mentioned to me because the JAMMA audio output were hitting about 4V, and line levels should be around 400mV. The stereo I have puts out a comfortable level when I have the volume adjusted for what I would use in a cabinet, so it's just a nice to have, not a need to have, but that's at least the thinking behind that ratio, and I feel I've reduced the potential for damage. By putting a potentiometer in place of one of the resistors you can make it variable, if you wish.

Neo Alec said:

What kind of connector does the Atomiswave use? I've never seen one in person, so I just kind of assumed it was on the jamma pins when people mentioned the stereo sound.

Click to expand...

A 10 pin, dual row, very small connector. It's identical to the 28 pin on the I/O connector for player 3-4, if you've seen it, but shorter. Four of the pins are +/- for stereo speakers on that connector. The manual seems to imply that they are amplified.

Neo Alec said:

The stereo Konami boards all have an auxiliary audio connector, so that's the one I have wiring for (it's just a stereo RCA wire with the correct 4-pin molex connector wired to the end). I also have one for Data East boards (similar but larger molex connector). If a game has stereo sound, I never want to miss out on it.

Since the types of connectors vary so much, I wouldn't dream of actually building the audio harnesses into the supergun. I just make the wires for the games I need. Same goes for the 3&4p wiring -- I mostly have boards with the Konami/Taito/Data East connectors, but there are exceptions like my Karate Blazers board (uses two jamma connectors instead) and my Hook board (proprietary connectors).

Click to expand...

I didn't build the audio harnesses into the supergun, I put a generic 4 pin outboard connector alongside the JAMMA connector. You build whatever connector to RCA for each required configuration, and then connect your RCA cables, I build a whatever connector to 4 pin molex, and hook it up (and, leave it with the board, if I only have one that fits). My RCA cables just stay hooked to my supergun at all times. We're doing the same thing, but you move the RCA cables, and I have the switchable attenuation circuit re-used in each case, because it's built into my supergun, where you don't need to if you don't have one. We each build one custom harness per stereo PCB cofiguration.

In fact, my supergun has, alongside the JAMMA connectors, this 4 pin molex connector (aux audio) and a 9 pin molex connector (buttons 4-6 and a ground). I have a 9pin to CPS2 adapter, built one, and that gives the ability to play these, anything else, I simply make another 9 pin molex to whatever the board requires for additional controls. Same idea as the audio.

Great to finally hear from another home user coming up with a solution for the stereo audio connections. Before, it seems like most people I'd seen mentioning it just used the jamma connector and went without. I was beginning to think I was alone coming up with solutions for these.

The audio connector on the Atomiswave sounds unnecessarily big. I wish more boards had just used stereo on the jamma connector the way MVS did. It would certainly make our superguns a lot easier to deal with.